1 00:00:30,682 --> 00:00:32,423 It's Michael, right? 2 00:00:32,467 --> 00:00:33,816 Yes.Crowe? 3 00:00:35,774 --> 00:00:38,690 Yes.Okay, Mike, my name is Ralph Claytor. 4 00:00:38,734 --> 00:00:40,953 I'm a detective with the Escondido Police Department. 5 00:00:40,997 --> 00:00:42,172 I work in the homicide unit. 6 00:00:43,652 --> 00:00:45,219 Okay, so, what I'd like to do, Mike, 7 00:00:45,262 --> 00:00:47,699 is go over some of the details of what's happened 8 00:00:47,743 --> 00:00:49,614 and get your side of the story. Is that okay? 9 00:00:51,225 --> 00:00:53,662 Yeah. Okay. 10 00:00:53,705 --> 00:00:57,231 What I'd like to do is just make sure you understand what your rights are. 11 00:00:57,274 --> 00:01:00,016 You have the right to remain silent. Do you understand that? 12 00:01:00,060 --> 00:01:02,149 Yes. Okay. 13 00:01:02,192 --> 00:01:05,065 Anything you say may be used against you in court. Do you understand that? 14 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:07,676 Yes. 15 00:01:07,719 --> 00:01:08,938 You have the right to the presence of an attorney. 16 00:01:10,331 --> 00:01:11,332 Do you understand that? 17 00:01:12,855 --> 00:01:14,117 Yes. 18 00:01:14,161 --> 00:01:16,076 If you can't afford an attorney, 19 00:01:16,119 --> 00:01:18,469 one will be appointed, free of charge, before we question you. 20 00:01:18,513 --> 00:01:20,080 Do you understand that? 21 00:01:20,123 --> 00:01:21,907 Yes. 22 00:01:21,951 --> 00:01:25,389 Have you talked to anyone else about this? Any of your friends? 23 00:01:25,433 --> 00:01:28,000 Um... Yeah. My friend Josh. 24 00:01:29,001 --> 00:01:30,829 Josh Treadway. 25 00:01:30,873 --> 00:01:32,875 Did you jokingly tell Josh anything? 26 00:01:32,918 --> 00:01:35,269 That you were involved? Or that you had something to do with it? 27 00:01:36,618 --> 00:01:40,100 No. 28 00:01:40,143 --> 00:01:44,452 What I'd like you to do is, just tell me what you know about this. 29 00:01:44,495 --> 00:01:47,672 I stayed home from school Monday, 30 00:01:47,716 --> 00:01:50,632 and again on Tuesday, because I had bronchitis. 31 00:01:52,329 --> 00:01:55,202 Hey, Michael. Soup's on. 32 00:01:55,245 --> 00:01:56,899 Mom, what do you mean, soup? 33 00:01:56,942 --> 00:01:57,943 It's just an expression, honey. 34 00:02:04,211 --> 00:02:05,690 Michael, pizza's here. 35 00:02:12,828 --> 00:02:14,351 Told you to knock first. 36 00:02:14,395 --> 00:02:15,178 We're eating, so come on. 37 00:02:17,963 --> 00:02:18,964 There's fungus on here. 38 00:02:23,230 --> 00:02:24,970 You're so filthy. 39 00:02:25,014 --> 00:02:26,755 Saw Mrs. Abbott at the video store. 40 00:02:26,798 --> 00:02:28,148 She says you blab too much in class. 41 00:02:28,191 --> 00:02:30,193 She did not. She'd never say that. 42 00:02:30,237 --> 00:02:32,761 Never say that.At least I don't get Ds and Fs. 43 00:02:32,804 --> 00:02:34,023 At least am not a blabbermouth. 44 00:02:34,066 --> 00:02:36,243 Hey, come on, guys, we're ready to eat. 45 00:02:36,286 --> 00:02:38,027 No, Michael, you're not gonna eat in here. Let's go. 46 00:02:41,291 --> 00:02:43,206 Congratulations, 47 00:02:43,250 --> 00:02:45,556 but you hit me in a bad moment, Frank. 48 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,168 I got an A+ on my English paper. 49 00:02:48,211 --> 00:02:50,648 Good for you.Only Stacey Sandler and me did. 50 00:02:50,692 --> 00:02:53,042 "And I." Stacy Sandler and I. 51 00:02:54,870 --> 00:02:56,306 Went to pick up our photos today, and they said they lost 'em. 52 00:02:56,350 --> 00:02:58,787 Really? 53 00:02:58,830 --> 00:03:00,876 Yeah, they said they filed it under somebody else's name or something. 54 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:03,966 Okay, Stephanie, Shannon, let me get a picture of you guys. 55 00:03:04,009 --> 00:03:05,359 Come on, you, too, Michael. The three of you. 56 00:03:05,402 --> 00:03:07,448 Come on, humor me. It'll take two seconds. 57 00:03:08,318 --> 00:03:09,885 Take it of me. Me! 58 00:03:09,928 --> 00:03:12,279 Okay, kids, try and act like you love each other. 59 00:03:12,322 --> 00:03:14,716 Yeah, I know it's tough. 60 00:03:14,759 --> 00:03:16,326 There you go. 61 00:03:18,502 --> 00:03:19,895 Revenge! 62 00:03:21,505 --> 00:03:23,203 Okay, and here's one for us. 63 00:03:24,813 --> 00:03:28,120 See, variables stand for a number. 64 00:03:28,164 --> 00:03:30,514 The name variable is picked because it can stand 65 00:03:30,558 --> 00:03:32,995 for different numbers at different times. 66 00:03:33,038 --> 00:03:34,692 China said Wednesday... 67 00:03:34,736 --> 00:03:36,041 I hope you're not getting Michael's bug. 68 00:03:36,607 --> 00:03:37,956 Hmm... No. 69 00:03:38,914 --> 00:03:40,829 Oh, it's just a headache. 70 00:03:43,788 --> 00:03:45,529 Is he studying? 71 00:03:45,573 --> 00:03:47,705 Oh, he's helping Stephanie. 72 00:03:47,749 --> 00:03:49,272 He's a smart kid. 73 00:03:49,316 --> 00:03:51,622 Oh, I know that. That's not the issue. 74 00:03:51,666 --> 00:03:53,320 Honey, it's freshman year. 75 00:03:53,363 --> 00:03:55,583 You remember what freshman year was like for me. Come on. 76 00:03:55,626 --> 00:03:56,932 Cheryl, you don't got to make excuses for him. 77 00:03:56,975 --> 00:03:58,847 I'm not making excuses for him. 78 00:03:58,890 --> 00:04:01,066 I think that thing the other night with the teachers, 79 00:04:01,110 --> 00:04:02,720 that was really good.Yeah. 80 00:04:02,764 --> 00:04:05,462 And he promised that he was gonna study harder, 81 00:04:05,506 --> 00:04:07,682 and they said they'd give him more challenging work. 82 00:04:07,725 --> 00:04:09,336 They said he could be doing college work. 83 00:04:09,379 --> 00:04:11,207 Right. So that's why he's pulling Ds? 84 00:04:11,251 --> 00:04:13,253 He's bored. Bored? 85 00:04:13,296 --> 00:04:15,603 Well, welcome to the world. I get bored, too, painting cars all day long, 86 00:04:15,646 --> 00:04:18,127 but that's just life. It's a part of living. 87 00:04:18,170 --> 00:04:21,609 You know, growing up. He's gotta show some responsibility. 88 00:04:21,652 --> 00:04:25,656 Well, we took away that PlayStation thing. 89 00:04:25,700 --> 00:04:27,789 Yeah, frankly, I don't even think he needs that. 90 00:04:27,832 --> 00:04:30,357 He can play those games in his head. 91 00:04:32,750 --> 00:04:34,926 Hey!Honey, look at you. That's gorgeous. 92 00:04:34,970 --> 00:04:37,102 That's the dress for the, um, volunteer banquet. 93 00:04:37,146 --> 00:04:39,235 The library thing.Ah! Nice. 94 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:40,932 Get these out, you'll hurt yourself. 95 00:04:40,976 --> 00:04:43,848 Come here. You're always joking. 96 00:04:43,892 --> 00:04:46,547 You look real pretty, sweetheart.You do. 97 00:04:46,590 --> 00:04:48,375 Now, go change so this dress still looks like new. 98 00:04:51,465 --> 00:04:53,728 Night, Mommy. Night, Daddy. I love you. 99 00:04:53,771 --> 00:04:55,207 Good night. Love you, too.Love you. 100 00:04:55,251 --> 00:04:56,687 Brush your teeth.I will. 101 00:05:13,225 --> 00:05:14,357 It's just the cat. 102 00:05:19,884 --> 00:05:21,233 I went to sleep. 103 00:05:23,061 --> 00:05:24,715 I don't know how long after, 104 00:05:24,759 --> 00:05:25,716 but the next thing, 105 00:05:27,370 --> 00:05:31,243 there was a pounding coming from somewhere. 106 00:05:31,287 --> 00:05:34,290 I thought someone was knocking on the door and someone had got it. 107 00:05:35,335 --> 00:05:38,425 So, I went back to sleep. 108 00:05:41,515 --> 00:05:45,388 The next thing I remember, I woke up with a bad headache. 109 00:05:48,826 --> 00:05:51,438 I turned on the TV, so I could see because it was dark. 110 00:05:52,830 --> 00:05:54,136 The clock said 4:30. 111 00:05:57,269 --> 00:05:58,793 So I got up, 112 00:05:59,881 --> 00:06:01,752 opened my door, 113 00:06:01,796 --> 00:06:05,190 and went to the kitchen to get something for my headache. 114 00:06:09,020 --> 00:06:10,457 I got a glass of milk, 115 00:06:11,414 --> 00:06:13,068 some Tylenol, 116 00:06:13,111 --> 00:06:14,548 and I took that back to my room. 117 00:06:16,201 --> 00:06:18,334 And I took the Tylenol, 118 00:06:19,291 --> 00:06:20,205 drank the milk. 119 00:06:22,382 --> 00:06:25,950 I turned off my TV, shut the door, 120 00:06:26,821 --> 00:06:27,822 and went to sleep. 121 00:06:29,432 --> 00:06:31,478 When you were coming back, 122 00:06:31,521 --> 00:06:32,783 do you remember if Shannon's door 123 00:06:32,827 --> 00:06:34,437 was open or shut? 124 00:06:35,873 --> 00:06:37,092 Um... 125 00:06:37,135 --> 00:06:38,572 When I walked back, 126 00:06:39,747 --> 00:06:40,835 all the doors... 127 00:06:45,100 --> 00:06:49,321 I pretty much remember all the doors being shut. 128 00:06:49,365 --> 00:06:50,758 The door to Stephanie's room, too? 129 00:06:54,631 --> 00:06:55,980 Yes. 130 00:06:56,024 --> 00:06:57,547 I think that was shut. 131 00:07:35,759 --> 00:07:37,674 Oh, God! 132 00:07:37,718 --> 00:07:39,720 Oh, God! No! No! 133 00:07:40,677 --> 00:07:43,463 Oh, my God! No! 134 00:07:45,682 --> 00:07:47,989 Cheryl...No! My baby! 135 00:07:48,032 --> 00:07:50,557 Oh, my God! No! 136 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:52,123 She's not breathing. 137 00:07:52,167 --> 00:07:53,473 Oh, Stephen! 138 00:07:54,735 --> 00:07:56,998 Stephen, she's so cold! 139 00:07:57,041 --> 00:07:59,130 Oh, Stephen, she's cold! 140 00:07:59,174 --> 00:08:00,958 It's my daughter! 141 00:08:01,002 --> 00:08:03,047 She's laying on the floor. She's not breathing. 142 00:08:03,091 --> 00:08:04,527 There's blood all over the place. 143 00:08:04,571 --> 00:08:07,095 Please, someone's gotta help her. My daughter's dead! 144 00:08:11,621 --> 00:08:14,189 Please, do something! 145 00:08:14,232 --> 00:08:16,104 Somebody, do something! 146 00:08:16,147 --> 00:08:19,107 My baby! My baby girl!STEPHEN: 1475... 147 00:08:19,150 --> 00:08:20,978 14750 Valley Center Road. 148 00:08:21,022 --> 00:08:22,850 Please, you gotta... You gotta get here fast! 149 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:52,532 Nobody talk to each other. 150 00:09:30,352 --> 00:09:32,093 Who all was here?Just the immediate family. 151 00:09:32,136 --> 00:09:33,964 They inside?Yes, sir. 152 00:09:34,008 --> 00:09:36,271 Betesh and Walden walked off the perimeter of the house. 153 00:09:36,314 --> 00:09:38,490 No sign of forced entry. 154 00:09:38,534 --> 00:09:40,014 Some of the window screens are bent, 155 00:09:40,057 --> 00:09:41,189 but they've got dust and cobwebs on them. 156 00:09:41,232 --> 00:09:43,147 They haven't been moved. 157 00:09:43,191 --> 00:09:44,671 One entry was unlocked. 158 00:09:44,714 --> 00:09:47,543 It's a sliding door in the master bedroom. 159 00:09:47,587 --> 00:09:48,413 Someone could have come through there? 160 00:09:51,460 --> 00:09:53,331 Maybe. Maybe not. 161 00:10:12,699 --> 00:10:14,526 It's highly likely that the killer, or killers, 162 00:10:14,570 --> 00:10:17,660 were splattered with blood during the attack. 163 00:10:17,704 --> 00:10:21,664 Strange-looking guy, dirty blonde hair, roaming the neighborhood last night. 164 00:10:21,708 --> 00:10:23,013 When I asked him what he wanted, 165 00:10:23,057 --> 00:10:24,536 he said he was looking for someone named Tracy. 166 00:10:24,580 --> 00:10:26,713 Yeah, he knocked on my door, too, looking for this Tracy. 167 00:10:26,756 --> 00:10:30,760 12:30, I saw him standing in the driveway here, looking towards the house. 168 00:10:30,804 --> 00:10:32,501 And I told him to go away, and then I called 911. 169 00:10:34,198 --> 00:10:36,636 I want my mommy! 170 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:38,202 Where are you taking my kids? 171 00:10:38,246 --> 00:10:40,465 We have to separate you to take you to the station.No! 172 00:10:40,509 --> 00:10:43,555 It's standard procedure.No! You can't take my kids! 173 00:10:43,599 --> 00:10:45,470 You can't take my kids!OFFICER: Get in the car, ma'am. 174 00:10:45,514 --> 00:10:46,515 Watch your head. 175 00:10:48,517 --> 00:10:50,867 I need my kids! 176 00:10:50,911 --> 00:10:52,695 No! No! I need my kids! 177 00:10:55,045 --> 00:10:56,264 Mom! 178 00:10:58,266 --> 00:11:00,050 Please! 179 00:11:07,884 --> 00:11:09,669 Good. 180 00:11:09,712 --> 00:11:12,497 So that's your room, and Stephanie's down here. 181 00:11:13,673 --> 00:11:15,283 Whose bedroom is this? 182 00:11:15,326 --> 00:11:16,284 That's Michael's. 183 00:11:19,591 --> 00:11:21,202 Did your sister have any boyfriends? 184 00:11:23,639 --> 00:11:25,728 She had lots of friends. 185 00:11:25,772 --> 00:11:27,643 Any in particular that you can think of 186 00:11:27,687 --> 00:11:28,775 who maybe didn't like her? 187 00:11:33,562 --> 00:11:37,174 Would she confide in you and tell you things? Personal things? 188 00:11:37,871 --> 00:11:41,004 Usually. 189 00:11:41,048 --> 00:11:44,616 And she recently hasn't come to you with any problems she was having with somebody? 190 00:11:46,053 --> 00:11:47,532 No. 191 00:11:47,576 --> 00:11:49,883 Any problems between her and your folks? 192 00:11:50,753 --> 00:11:53,060 No. 193 00:11:53,103 --> 00:11:57,238 Anything you ever noticed between your dad and her? 194 00:11:57,281 --> 00:12:00,241 Anything that was maybe, kind of, 195 00:12:02,112 --> 00:12:03,157 not right? 196 00:12:04,419 --> 00:12:05,594 No, not at all. 197 00:12:09,293 --> 00:12:11,208 I need to see my kids! 198 00:12:12,601 --> 00:12:14,472 Mrs. Crowe...I don't understand. 199 00:12:14,516 --> 00:12:17,432 Where are my kids? Where is my husband? 200 00:12:17,475 --> 00:12:20,087 We have to talk to each of you separately first. 201 00:12:20,130 --> 00:12:22,045 Now, you were saying something woke you. 202 00:12:25,396 --> 00:12:26,746 A sound. 203 00:12:28,704 --> 00:12:31,533 Like a bedroom door opening. I figured it was the cat. 204 00:12:33,753 --> 00:12:35,189 Was your daughter sexually active? 205 00:12:38,670 --> 00:12:40,498 She's 12 years old. 206 00:12:42,457 --> 00:12:45,373 She's a 12-year-old little girl. 207 00:12:48,811 --> 00:12:50,204 She was very outgoing. 208 00:12:51,901 --> 00:12:53,163 She was very well liked. 209 00:12:56,036 --> 00:12:58,255 She just got an award at school. 210 00:12:58,299 --> 00:12:59,561 She won the citizenship award. 211 00:13:01,868 --> 00:13:02,825 Who'd wanna hurt her? 212 00:13:04,740 --> 00:13:07,090 There's no one. 213 00:13:07,134 --> 00:13:09,614 I mean... I wouldn't know anyone. She's 12 years old. 214 00:13:14,489 --> 00:13:16,621 What kind of a relationship would you say you had with your daughter? 215 00:13:16,665 --> 00:13:18,188 Would you say you were close? 216 00:13:18,232 --> 00:13:19,407 She was... 217 00:13:26,414 --> 00:13:28,764 Would you say there was anything about your behavior that 218 00:13:29,896 --> 00:13:31,071 someone might look at and 219 00:13:32,724 --> 00:13:36,206 characterize as unsuitable or, say, inappropriate? 220 00:13:36,250 --> 00:13:37,251 No, of course not. 221 00:13:39,296 --> 00:13:40,341 Of course not. 222 00:13:42,517 --> 00:13:44,562 Officer, my... 223 00:13:44,606 --> 00:13:45,563 My little girl was killed. 224 00:13:46,608 --> 00:13:48,828 She was killed in my own home. 225 00:13:48,871 --> 00:13:50,568 And I didn't stop it. 226 00:13:50,612 --> 00:13:52,483 I didn't... I didn't... Couldn't do anything about it. 227 00:14:17,378 --> 00:14:19,815 You? 228 00:14:19,859 --> 00:14:22,949 Stephen, how could they, even for one minute, think you had anything... 229 00:14:22,992 --> 00:14:25,995 Listen, they... They're saying now that they wanna take some pictures of us. 230 00:14:26,039 --> 00:14:27,779 We... 231 00:14:33,655 --> 00:14:35,962 Detective, no. 232 00:14:36,005 --> 00:14:37,702 You know, I mean... They can't. 233 00:14:37,746 --> 00:14:40,618 So, no more today, please.Mr. Crowe, 234 00:14:40,662 --> 00:14:43,317 this will help us to eliminate all the family members. 235 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,102 No. I'm telling you. That's it. We're not going through any more here, today. 236 00:14:46,146 --> 00:14:48,148 Fine. You can either cooperate, 237 00:14:48,191 --> 00:14:49,758 or you can wait in a cell till we get a court order. 238 00:14:50,193 --> 00:14:51,803 Either/or. 239 00:14:51,847 --> 00:14:52,979 It could take days. 240 00:15:04,904 --> 00:15:08,516 Now, listen, guys. 241 00:15:08,559 --> 00:15:10,213 They... They're saying that they... Michael. 242 00:15:11,649 --> 00:15:12,868 Michael. 243 00:15:14,043 --> 00:15:15,523 Listen. They're... They're telling me that 244 00:15:15,566 --> 00:15:18,221 they just wanna take some photographs of us now. 245 00:15:18,265 --> 00:15:19,396 Okay? So... So that's all right. 246 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,137 We'll just do that. 247 00:15:21,181 --> 00:15:22,834 Okay? We'll just do... We'll just do like they say. 248 00:15:23,966 --> 00:15:24,967 Right. 249 00:15:26,055 --> 00:15:27,578 It's the police. 250 00:15:27,622 --> 00:15:28,753 They're here to help us. 251 00:16:39,607 --> 00:16:40,782 Josh? 252 00:16:42,392 --> 00:16:43,828 Stephanie is dead. 253 00:16:45,830 --> 00:16:47,006 She's dead. 254 00:16:50,357 --> 00:16:52,185 Someone broke in and killed her. 255 00:16:55,101 --> 00:16:57,016 I saw her laying there on the floor. 256 00:17:02,238 --> 00:17:04,458 We've got a few more questions for you guys. 257 00:17:04,501 --> 00:17:06,199 You wanna go with Detective Farber for a few moments? 258 00:17:09,158 --> 00:17:10,377 It's okay, you go ahead. 259 00:17:14,642 --> 00:17:16,774 Go ahead. We... We'll see you in a minute. 260 00:17:16,818 --> 00:17:17,862 It's okay, sweetie. 261 00:17:22,476 --> 00:17:24,478 We're taking your children into protective custody. 262 00:17:25,522 --> 00:17:27,046 What! 263 00:17:27,089 --> 00:17:28,395 Protective custody? 264 00:17:28,438 --> 00:17:31,572 What the hell! Protective custody from who? 265 00:17:31,615 --> 00:17:34,662 You people have done nothing but lie to me all day! 266 00:17:34,705 --> 00:17:37,056 With an in-house killing, it's standard procedure 267 00:17:37,099 --> 00:17:39,058 to take the surviving children to a shelter. 268 00:17:39,101 --> 00:17:40,972 "Standard procedure." They just lost their sister! 269 00:17:41,016 --> 00:17:43,236 I wanna see my kids! You... 270 00:17:43,279 --> 00:17:45,847 I want you to bring me my kids right now! 271 00:17:45,890 --> 00:17:47,109 Stephen? 272 00:17:48,850 --> 00:17:51,635 If they're gonna find who did this to Stephanie, 273 00:17:51,679 --> 00:17:53,594 we have to do what we can to help. 274 00:18:02,168 --> 00:18:04,474 Dad, don't let them take us, please. 275 00:18:04,518 --> 00:18:06,563 It's gonna be okay.I don't wanna go, Mommy. 276 00:18:06,607 --> 00:18:08,174 These guys are... They're good guys. 277 00:18:08,217 --> 00:18:09,610 And we are gonna come and get you 278 00:18:09,653 --> 00:18:12,917 just as soon as we can. 279 00:18:12,961 --> 00:18:15,616 Daddy.It's okay, honey. Your mom is right, okay? 280 00:18:15,659 --> 00:18:17,792 It's all right. 281 00:18:17,835 --> 00:18:21,448 I know it's hard, but I need you to be very strong. 282 00:18:21,491 --> 00:18:23,450 The police are all here. 283 00:18:23,493 --> 00:18:25,756 They're doing everything they can to do their jobs. 284 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:28,063 We have to trust them. 285 00:18:28,107 --> 00:18:29,760 They're gonna do what's best.That's right. 286 00:18:29,804 --> 00:18:32,328 And we love you so much.We love you very much. 287 00:18:32,372 --> 00:18:34,504 We love you both so much. So much. 288 00:18:34,548 --> 00:18:35,636 It's okay. It's okay. 289 00:18:38,900 --> 00:18:40,293 It's okay, sweetie. 290 00:18:40,336 --> 00:18:42,077 Okay. 291 00:18:42,121 --> 00:18:45,602 It's all right. It's all right.STEPHEN: It's okay, Michael. 292 00:18:45,646 --> 00:18:47,387 Love you, honey.We love you. Be strong, Michael. 293 00:18:47,430 --> 00:18:49,780 We love you. We love you.We love you. 294 00:18:49,824 --> 00:18:51,130 We'll get you soon. 295 00:18:54,742 --> 00:18:56,700 No! No! 296 00:19:01,749 --> 00:19:02,924 Stephen... 297 00:19:10,061 --> 00:19:12,063 I don't mind. 298 00:19:12,107 --> 00:19:14,022 I just wanna help you guys out any way I can. 299 00:19:17,199 --> 00:19:19,070 Mr. Crowe, your brother. 300 00:19:26,295 --> 00:19:28,471 Stephanie's dead, David. 301 00:19:28,515 --> 00:19:30,169 My little girl is dead. 302 00:19:30,212 --> 00:19:31,909 I know. I know. 303 00:19:31,953 --> 00:19:34,173 Somebody killed her.I know. 304 00:19:34,216 --> 00:19:37,437 They wouldn't let us see you sooner. 305 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:40,353 They took Michael and Shannon. 306 00:19:40,396 --> 00:19:41,484 What?They did. They... 307 00:19:41,528 --> 00:19:43,269 They said they have to keep them. 308 00:19:43,312 --> 00:19:45,662 Okay, come on. We're taking you back to our place. 309 00:19:55,324 --> 00:19:57,935 Richie Tuite? I'm Detective Baker. 310 00:19:59,633 --> 00:20:03,811 Remember we talked down... Down here yesterday? 311 00:20:03,854 --> 00:20:07,467 About those girls that you followed into that apartment complex? 312 00:20:07,510 --> 00:20:09,556 This is something different. 313 00:20:09,599 --> 00:20:12,994 Richard, a lot of folks up Valley Center Road 314 00:20:13,037 --> 00:20:16,127 claim they saw someone with your description wandering around there last night. 315 00:20:16,780 --> 00:20:17,825 Were you? 316 00:20:20,784 --> 00:20:21,829 Who's Tracy, Richard? 317 00:20:22,656 --> 00:20:24,223 My girlfriend. 318 00:20:24,266 --> 00:20:25,224 She live up that way? 319 00:20:26,747 --> 00:20:27,791 Sometimes she does. 320 00:20:29,532 --> 00:20:30,925 And were you looking for her last night? 321 00:20:40,326 --> 00:20:43,067 Richard, we have to keep your clothes for testing. 322 00:20:43,111 --> 00:20:45,940 So you can just keep these brand-new ones. Is that okay? 323 00:20:45,983 --> 00:20:47,768 Okay.Okay. 324 00:20:47,811 --> 00:20:48,769 Well, we're letting you go. 325 00:20:51,380 --> 00:20:53,121 And I don't want to see you in here again, all right? 326 00:21:16,579 --> 00:21:18,581 Will our parents be coming, too? 327 00:21:18,625 --> 00:21:20,061 We'll see what happens in the morning. 328 00:21:20,931 --> 00:21:23,020 I want my mom. 329 00:21:23,064 --> 00:21:24,500 I want Mommy.It's okay. It's okay. 330 00:21:24,544 --> 00:21:26,720 Now, there are a couple of blankets there. 331 00:21:26,763 --> 00:21:29,505 If you need anything, someone will be down the hall, at the desk. 332 00:21:39,123 --> 00:21:41,604 It's okay. 333 00:21:45,739 --> 00:21:47,131 Clothes, for the morning. 334 00:21:50,613 --> 00:21:52,528 If you need anything, anything at all. 335 00:22:11,199 --> 00:22:12,722 I don't think I can bear this. 336 00:22:20,382 --> 00:22:22,123 I don't think I can bear this. 337 00:22:32,612 --> 00:22:34,353 I don't think I can bear this. 338 00:22:48,802 --> 00:22:50,456 I don't understand. 339 00:22:50,499 --> 00:22:53,067 What do you mean, we can't see them or talk to them? 340 00:22:53,110 --> 00:22:55,374 Why would you separate children from their parents? 341 00:22:55,417 --> 00:22:57,419 It's pretty much routine in cases like these. 342 00:22:57,463 --> 00:22:59,421 But at a time like this? 343 00:22:59,465 --> 00:23:01,075 With what they've been through? 344 00:23:01,118 --> 00:23:05,253 Detective, how are my children supposed to understand? 345 00:23:05,296 --> 00:23:08,387 They're so young. They need us. 346 00:23:08,430 --> 00:23:11,346 Mr. Crowe, we're gonna wanna talk to you again later today. 347 00:23:20,050 --> 00:23:21,225 Josh Treadway? 348 00:23:23,576 --> 00:23:24,707 Josh, who is it? 349 00:23:29,930 --> 00:23:31,192 What's this? 350 00:23:31,235 --> 00:23:33,977 A woodcarving project I'm doing for school. 351 00:23:34,021 --> 00:23:35,892 He says he just wants to ask me some questions. 352 00:23:42,508 --> 00:23:44,814 Whose is this?The knife? My brother's. 353 00:23:46,990 --> 00:23:50,516 Uh... My mom's on her way home. 354 00:23:50,559 --> 00:23:52,779 That's fine. This is just routine. 355 00:23:52,822 --> 00:23:54,433 We are just going around talking to some of Michael's friends. 356 00:23:59,612 --> 00:24:02,092 Well, we've pretty much finished searching the area. 357 00:24:02,136 --> 00:24:04,355 Found an igloo cooler and an old pair of blue socks. 358 00:24:05,052 --> 00:24:06,532 No knife. 359 00:24:06,575 --> 00:24:07,924 Keep looking. 360 00:24:19,501 --> 00:24:21,024 Anything we should know about? 361 00:24:21,068 --> 00:24:23,157 Autopsy showed eight stab wounds. 362 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,855 Was she molested?No. No evidence of it. 363 00:24:25,899 --> 00:24:28,031 Detective, there is something I think you should see in here. 364 00:24:32,819 --> 00:24:35,996 Final Fantasy 7, Gauntlet... 365 00:24:40,435 --> 00:24:42,568 Here's another one he did himself. 366 00:24:42,611 --> 00:24:44,265 It's all about Dungeons & Dragons. 367 00:24:49,705 --> 00:24:50,706 Here, look at that. 368 00:25:14,034 --> 00:25:15,992 You know, we're really trying to believe what you're saying. 369 00:25:17,994 --> 00:25:20,344 Would you have any problem taking a truth verification exam? 370 00:25:22,912 --> 00:25:23,870 What's the problem, Mike? 371 00:25:27,134 --> 00:25:28,222 I feel like... 372 00:25:31,225 --> 00:25:33,140 I just feel like... 373 00:25:33,183 --> 00:25:34,489 Tell me what you feel like. 374 00:25:37,492 --> 00:25:40,321 I've spent all day away from my family. 375 00:25:40,364 --> 00:25:42,192 I feel like I'm being treated like I killed 376 00:25:42,236 --> 00:25:43,498 my sister, but I didn't. 377 00:25:44,630 --> 00:25:45,935 All right, Mike. 378 00:25:45,979 --> 00:25:47,894 You need to trust me on this. 379 00:25:47,937 --> 00:25:49,635 This is gonna work out. 380 00:25:49,678 --> 00:25:52,681 Like I told you, I'm not blaming anyone. 381 00:25:52,725 --> 00:25:54,117 We're just trying to get to the truth. 382 00:25:58,513 --> 00:26:00,646 Mike, this is Chris McDonough. 383 00:26:00,689 --> 00:26:02,473 Chris is with the Oceanside Police Department. 384 00:26:04,867 --> 00:26:06,086 Hey, Michael. 385 00:26:09,219 --> 00:26:10,394 How you doing, pal? 386 00:26:13,180 --> 00:26:14,355 Uh... I don't know. 387 00:26:15,661 --> 00:26:16,618 Pretty hard? 388 00:26:18,054 --> 00:26:19,099 Okay. 389 00:26:21,057 --> 00:26:22,276 I have a son who's 14. 390 00:26:23,930 --> 00:26:25,496 If my son ever did something, 391 00:26:26,628 --> 00:26:28,630 which he has. 392 00:26:28,674 --> 00:26:32,025 He took some candy out of a store and got caught. 393 00:26:32,068 --> 00:26:34,157 And the hardest thing for him to do was... 394 00:26:36,377 --> 00:26:37,596 What do you think? 395 00:26:41,948 --> 00:26:42,688 Admit it. 396 00:26:43,340 --> 00:26:44,341 Yeah. 397 00:26:45,342 --> 00:26:46,474 You ever heard that saying, 398 00:26:48,432 --> 00:26:50,521 "No man got to the top of the mountain 399 00:26:50,565 --> 00:26:51,435 "by falling there"? 400 00:26:53,786 --> 00:26:55,701 How does a man get to the top of a mountain? 401 00:27:00,140 --> 00:27:01,402 He's gotta climb.Yeah. 402 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:03,404 You've gotta climb. 403 00:27:04,405 --> 00:27:07,103 Sometimes that's difficult. 404 00:27:07,147 --> 00:27:09,279 Sometimes things get out of control, 405 00:27:09,323 --> 00:27:12,456 and sometimes, just like anything else, 406 00:27:12,500 --> 00:27:14,589 nobody wants to say, "Yeah, I made a mistake." 407 00:27:16,243 --> 00:27:17,200 I mean, do you? 408 00:27:18,462 --> 00:27:19,594 Of course not. 409 00:27:21,422 --> 00:27:22,989 That doesn't make you a bad person, does it? 410 00:27:28,734 --> 00:27:29,648 Of course not. 411 00:27:32,302 --> 00:27:36,785 This instrument is what they call a Computer Voice Stress Analyzer. 412 00:27:36,829 --> 00:27:39,527 It's so accurate, it was controlled by the government for a long time, 413 00:27:39,570 --> 00:27:40,920 because it's so accurate. 414 00:27:43,270 --> 00:27:45,838 If you had done this, would you tell us? 415 00:27:47,274 --> 00:27:48,797 Yes. 416 00:27:48,841 --> 00:27:49,668 And why? 417 00:27:52,061 --> 00:27:53,497 Because if I did this, 418 00:27:56,283 --> 00:27:57,806 I mean, I'd have to be out of my mind. 419 00:27:59,939 --> 00:28:02,463 I would feel like I would need to be punished. 420 00:28:04,073 --> 00:28:05,292 Punished or helped? 421 00:28:06,249 --> 00:28:07,642 Punishment's a harsh word. 422 00:28:08,948 --> 00:28:10,210 If I did that, 423 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:13,822 I should be punished. 424 00:28:14,910 --> 00:28:16,738 Because... 425 00:28:16,782 --> 00:28:18,305 I... I mean, 426 00:28:18,348 --> 00:28:19,610 once you've done that, 427 00:28:22,135 --> 00:28:23,049 you can't forget it. 428 00:28:25,051 --> 00:28:27,401 I don't believe that it's possible to ever forget it. 429 00:28:28,794 --> 00:28:30,273 Kinda grinds on you, doesn't it? 430 00:28:31,448 --> 00:28:33,320 Yeah. 431 00:28:33,363 --> 00:28:34,625 Almost like a cancer. 432 00:28:37,237 --> 00:28:39,979 Eventually, the only freedom an individual gets is, 433 00:28:40,022 --> 00:28:41,545 you have to let it go. 434 00:28:44,984 --> 00:28:45,767 Yeah. 435 00:28:47,421 --> 00:28:48,683 I sense that there is something there 436 00:28:48,727 --> 00:28:49,815 we need to talk about. 437 00:28:49,858 --> 00:28:52,078 I'm just being honest with you. Okay? 438 00:28:53,906 --> 00:28:58,084 Now, I don't know, because am not in your mind, okay? 439 00:28:58,127 --> 00:29:01,391 But if there was something that we should be aware of, you know... 440 00:29:01,435 --> 00:29:04,743 I'm a pretty good guy. You obviously can sense that. 441 00:29:07,789 --> 00:29:08,616 Yeah. 442 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:12,751 This'll help. 443 00:29:14,927 --> 00:29:15,884 It's a tool, 444 00:29:18,017 --> 00:29:18,757 and it won't lie. 445 00:29:23,457 --> 00:29:24,545 Is the wall gray? 446 00:29:26,503 --> 00:29:27,374 Yes. 447 00:29:29,376 --> 00:29:30,551 Are you sitting down? 448 00:29:32,248 --> 00:29:33,206 Yes. 449 00:29:34,773 --> 00:29:35,686 A little louder. 450 00:29:37,340 --> 00:29:38,559 Are you sitting down? 451 00:29:39,734 --> 00:29:41,083 Yes. 452 00:29:43,869 --> 00:29:45,609 Do you know who took Stephanie's life? 453 00:29:46,393 --> 00:29:47,698 No. 454 00:29:49,048 --> 00:29:50,223 Is today Thursday? 455 00:29:51,354 --> 00:29:52,616 Yes. 456 00:29:53,966 --> 00:29:56,055 Did you take Stephanie's life? 457 00:29:56,098 --> 00:29:57,360 No. 458 00:30:02,757 --> 00:30:05,629 I don't know why it says I was lying right there, I was being truthful. 459 00:30:06,848 --> 00:30:08,937 Michael, 460 00:30:08,981 --> 00:30:12,027 these investigators, out at your house, they're top-notch. 461 00:30:12,071 --> 00:30:14,029 They're going to find all sorts of stuff. You know that? 462 00:30:15,814 --> 00:30:17,903 I know. 463 00:30:17,946 --> 00:30:20,383 I don't know what to do anymore. 464 00:30:20,427 --> 00:30:22,777 I'm being told that I'm lying, and I'm not lying. 465 00:30:22,821 --> 00:30:23,952 Michael, I'm not saying that. 466 00:30:23,996 --> 00:30:27,129 I don't know who did this. I swear! 467 00:30:27,173 --> 00:30:31,438 One of the investigators told me they found some hair. 468 00:30:31,481 --> 00:30:34,833 Whoever did this, she pulled some hair. What if it's your hair? 469 00:30:34,876 --> 00:30:37,096 It couldn't be.I'm just saying, what if it is? 470 00:30:39,402 --> 00:30:42,884 You want some water or something?No, I'm fine. 471 00:30:42,928 --> 00:30:45,452 I just want... 472 00:30:45,495 --> 00:30:47,062 You want this to be over with? 473 00:30:47,106 --> 00:30:48,542 I want this over with. 474 00:30:48,585 --> 00:30:50,979 I want this over with for you, too. 475 00:30:51,023 --> 00:30:53,329 Look, what if they come back and say, 476 00:30:53,373 --> 00:30:56,724 "Michael, we found your hair in her hand"? 477 00:30:56,767 --> 00:30:59,205 Hypothetically, could that have happened? 478 00:30:59,248 --> 00:31:01,076 No, not that I know of. 479 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:02,904 Not that you know of? 480 00:31:02,948 --> 00:31:05,776 Like I said, I would have to be completely unaware of it. 481 00:31:06,865 --> 00:31:09,432 Have you ever blacked out before? 482 00:31:10,433 --> 00:31:11,782 No, never. 483 00:31:13,088 --> 00:31:16,265 What are you pushing back?Nothing. 484 00:31:16,309 --> 00:31:18,615 I can see. You're... You're tightening up. 485 00:31:18,659 --> 00:31:20,008 Like you're fighting yourself. 486 00:31:20,052 --> 00:31:21,227 I'm just trying to get through this! 487 00:31:27,929 --> 00:31:28,974 I loved her. 488 00:31:31,585 --> 00:31:33,065 I loved her deeply. 489 00:31:34,370 --> 00:31:35,328 I know you did. 490 00:31:36,633 --> 00:31:37,808 I mean, this is your sister. 491 00:31:38,984 --> 00:31:39,898 We understand that. 492 00:31:47,296 --> 00:31:48,515 I called, um, 493 00:31:50,169 --> 00:31:54,129 the police station tonight, to see if I could... 494 00:31:56,566 --> 00:31:58,177 Stephanie and I, 495 00:31:58,220 --> 00:32:00,005 um, we found the cutest little dress 496 00:32:01,267 --> 00:32:02,355 for that banquet. 497 00:32:03,486 --> 00:32:04,879 So cute. 498 00:32:04,923 --> 00:32:07,055 And I called them to see if I... If I could get it, 499 00:32:09,797 --> 00:32:10,841 so she could be buried in it. 500 00:32:15,324 --> 00:32:17,674 They have her things, her clothes. 501 00:32:19,546 --> 00:32:20,808 All her things. 502 00:32:21,678 --> 00:32:22,766 What did they say? 503 00:32:26,770 --> 00:32:27,946 Oh, Cheryl. 504 00:32:29,860 --> 00:32:31,601 I can't help it. I just 505 00:32:34,561 --> 00:32:37,781 keep thinking about her there. Where they have her. 506 00:32:40,871 --> 00:32:41,829 All alone. 507 00:32:47,182 --> 00:32:48,140 And I can't... 508 00:32:49,619 --> 00:32:50,969 I can't help it, I keep thinking that 509 00:32:53,623 --> 00:32:56,322 she's never gonna go to New York like she always talked about. 510 00:32:56,365 --> 00:32:57,801 Did you know that she wanted to do that? 511 00:32:58,889 --> 00:32:59,847 Yeah, she told me. 512 00:33:02,067 --> 00:33:05,113 And she's never gonna graduate. 513 00:33:05,157 --> 00:33:07,507 And she's never gonna go to college herself. 514 00:33:09,030 --> 00:33:12,251 And she's never gonna get married, have kids. 515 00:33:17,604 --> 00:33:21,042 I lived here my whole life, 516 00:33:21,086 --> 00:33:23,131 and I always thought it was safe! 517 00:33:24,219 --> 00:33:25,655 And my baby... 518 00:33:27,135 --> 00:33:30,138 I'm just so sorry. 519 00:33:30,182 --> 00:33:31,400 Oh, God. 520 00:33:35,187 --> 00:33:38,712 Mike, let me explain a few things. 521 00:33:38,755 --> 00:33:39,930 We have a lot of things going for us 522 00:33:39,974 --> 00:33:41,845 in the way of technology. 523 00:33:41,889 --> 00:33:43,630 We do things like... 524 00:33:43,673 --> 00:33:47,025 We don't just get the type of hair and color of hair, 525 00:33:47,068 --> 00:33:50,332 we go all the way to the roots and we get things like the DNA. 526 00:33:50,376 --> 00:33:54,336 And with the DNA, we can tell the exact person with a 99.9% accuracy. 527 00:33:56,991 --> 00:33:58,949 You remember there was a lot of blood? 528 00:33:58,993 --> 00:34:00,777 See, it's very different... Mike. 529 00:34:00,821 --> 00:34:02,779 Hey, Mike? Mike. 530 00:34:02,823 --> 00:34:05,478 You need to stay with me. 531 00:34:05,521 --> 00:34:08,176 It's very difficult for the person who did it not to get blood on them 532 00:34:08,220 --> 00:34:09,308 and not to transfer that blood 533 00:34:09,351 --> 00:34:10,874 to other parts of the house. 534 00:34:13,138 --> 00:34:14,791 We found blood in your room already. 535 00:34:17,577 --> 00:34:18,491 God! 536 00:34:19,448 --> 00:34:20,841 Where did you find it? 537 00:34:20,884 --> 00:34:22,408 I'm sure you know. 538 00:34:22,451 --> 00:34:24,410 It's easy to make mistakes in the dark. 539 00:34:24,453 --> 00:34:27,195 God! God!Rather than put our team through any more, 540 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:29,328 can you tell me what you did with the knife? 541 00:34:29,371 --> 00:34:32,113 No, I don't know. I didn't do this! 542 00:34:32,157 --> 00:34:34,115 Does that mean you can't tell me about the knife? 543 00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:35,595 I don't know what you're talking about. 544 00:34:39,425 --> 00:34:40,339 You're 14? 545 00:34:41,079 --> 00:34:42,993 Yes. 546 00:34:43,037 --> 00:34:44,473 You've got your whole life ahead of you, don't you? 547 00:34:46,475 --> 00:34:48,434 I don't know if I have it anymore. 548 00:34:50,566 --> 00:34:51,698 Mike, 549 00:34:53,091 --> 00:34:55,136 why did this happen? 550 00:34:55,180 --> 00:34:57,573 I'm going to throw up. 551 00:34:57,617 --> 00:34:59,358 Are you getting sick? 552 00:34:59,401 --> 00:35:03,144 I... I didn't do it.You need to help me here, Mike. 553 00:35:03,188 --> 00:35:05,799 You need to help me here, Mike.I know! I know! 554 00:35:05,842 --> 00:35:08,845 I would, but I didn't do this. I didn't. 555 00:35:08,889 --> 00:35:10,282 This is horrible! 556 00:35:10,325 --> 00:35:11,979 You know what? You know what? 557 00:35:12,022 --> 00:35:14,024 It is terrible.Oh, God! 558 00:35:14,068 --> 00:35:17,898 And you know what else? We can live through it. 559 00:35:17,941 --> 00:35:20,118 You can live through it.I didn't do it. 560 00:35:20,161 --> 00:35:22,337 And you know what else? We can help you with that. 561 00:35:22,381 --> 00:35:25,514 But you need to help us understand how to help you. 562 00:35:25,558 --> 00:35:29,257 Now, just because a person makes a mistake and does something bad, 563 00:35:29,301 --> 00:35:31,564 A, it doesn't mean that the world comes to an end, 564 00:35:31,607 --> 00:35:34,436 and B, it doesn't mean that you're a bad person.God! God! 565 00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:36,917 Good people do bad things. 566 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,311 Why are you doing this to me? 567 00:35:39,354 --> 00:35:40,964 I didn't do this! 568 00:35:47,406 --> 00:35:48,842 If... If I did, 569 00:35:50,670 --> 00:35:52,715 I don't remember it. 570 00:35:52,759 --> 00:35:54,152 God! 571 00:35:55,588 --> 00:35:56,980 You know what? 572 00:35:58,634 --> 00:35:59,896 That's possible. 573 00:36:01,115 --> 00:36:03,204 Have you ever blacked out before? 574 00:36:03,248 --> 00:36:05,859 No... Not that I know of. 575 00:36:05,902 --> 00:36:09,036 What's gonna happen to me now? 576 00:36:09,079 --> 00:36:10,820 Even though I don't even know if I did it, 577 00:36:10,864 --> 00:36:12,909 what's gonna happen? 578 00:36:12,953 --> 00:36:16,652 I'm gonna try everything that the system can muster to help you through this. 579 00:36:16,696 --> 00:36:18,785 But you know what? It can be done. 580 00:36:18,828 --> 00:36:20,265 God! 581 00:36:20,308 --> 00:36:21,353 God! 582 00:36:21,831 --> 00:36:23,181 God! 583 00:36:23,703 --> 00:36:24,965 Oh, God! 584 00:36:29,752 --> 00:36:32,059 My whole life is just down the drain now, 585 00:36:33,321 --> 00:36:34,975 and I don't even remember. 586 00:36:37,412 --> 00:36:38,196 Oh... 587 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:43,201 God. 588 00:37:02,916 --> 00:37:05,092 Michael, you were gone so long. Where were you? 589 00:37:06,136 --> 00:37:07,181 What's wrong? 590 00:37:11,316 --> 00:37:12,926 Michael, where were you? 591 00:37:15,668 --> 00:37:17,017 They think I did it. 592 00:37:24,807 --> 00:37:28,202 Now, the reason you're back today is because we feel there is evidence 593 00:37:28,246 --> 00:37:30,248 that warrants us talking to you in greater detail. 594 00:37:31,901 --> 00:37:32,946 Okay. 595 00:37:35,601 --> 00:37:37,559 It really doesn't matter to me whether we even get that far. 596 00:37:38,908 --> 00:37:40,519 We could just talk about you. 597 00:37:42,434 --> 00:37:43,783 And quite frankly, that's more interesting than 598 00:37:43,826 --> 00:37:44,958 that other stuff for me. 599 00:37:46,742 --> 00:37:47,787 How do you feel about that? 600 00:37:50,093 --> 00:37:51,051 I don't know. 601 00:37:52,966 --> 00:37:53,749 It's just... 602 00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:57,057 Last night was the worst night of my life. 603 00:37:57,971 --> 00:37:59,755 Okay. Why? 604 00:38:04,064 --> 00:38:05,892 Have you ever had one of your siblings killed? 605 00:38:14,857 --> 00:38:18,557 So, we're all set for day after tomorrow. 606 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,995 After the service, we'll proceed from the church to the cemetery. 607 00:38:26,304 --> 00:38:28,610 Just take all the time you want. 608 00:38:53,766 --> 00:38:56,377 My God. This... This dress. 609 00:39:01,774 --> 00:39:03,341 It's pretty. 610 00:39:06,039 --> 00:39:07,475 She looks real pretty. 611 00:39:22,621 --> 00:39:25,711 Once everybody understands, I know that people will be able to forgive. 612 00:39:25,754 --> 00:39:28,191 But I didn't do it. 613 00:39:28,235 --> 00:39:30,411 The good part of Michael didn't do it. 614 00:39:30,455 --> 00:39:32,282 The Michael who helps his sister, 615 00:39:32,326 --> 00:39:33,806 the Michael who helps her with her math... 616 00:39:33,849 --> 00:39:35,634 I didn't do this. 617 00:39:35,677 --> 00:39:36,722 You know what I think? 618 00:39:39,159 --> 00:39:41,770 I kind of think there's two parts to Michael. 619 00:39:41,814 --> 00:39:43,598 The part who loved your sister, 620 00:39:43,642 --> 00:39:45,513 and who did good for your sister, 621 00:39:45,557 --> 00:39:48,429 and then the other part that's not so good, 622 00:39:48,473 --> 00:39:50,388 and that unconsciously comes out. 623 00:39:54,870 --> 00:39:57,351 If it's true, that's the most horrible thought in the world. 624 00:39:59,135 --> 00:40:00,789 What's your greatest fear right now? 625 00:40:02,922 --> 00:40:04,097 That I'm crazy. 626 00:40:06,316 --> 00:40:08,536 There's someone else inside of me, 627 00:40:08,580 --> 00:40:10,625 and I don't know who they are or what they do, 628 00:40:12,366 --> 00:40:14,107 and they could lock me up 629 00:40:14,150 --> 00:40:16,239 for something I can't even remember, 630 00:40:16,283 --> 00:40:19,329 for a very long time. 631 00:40:19,373 --> 00:40:21,723 I'm not sure that locking you up is the answer. 632 00:40:21,767 --> 00:40:22,637 You know what else? 633 00:40:24,030 --> 00:40:25,640 What? 634 00:40:25,684 --> 00:40:27,250 We don't do that to 14-year-olds. 635 00:40:31,037 --> 00:40:32,865 What do you do to them? 636 00:40:34,083 --> 00:40:35,868 We look for understanding. 637 00:40:35,911 --> 00:40:37,522 And we try to help. 638 00:40:37,565 --> 00:40:38,958 But it's a two-way street. 639 00:40:39,001 --> 00:40:40,829 You cooperate with me, 640 00:40:40,873 --> 00:40:42,004 I cooperate with you. 641 00:40:43,615 --> 00:40:44,877 I wish I could help you, 642 00:40:46,139 --> 00:40:47,923 but I don't know what happened. 643 00:40:47,967 --> 00:40:49,359 I swear to you. 644 00:40:49,403 --> 00:40:50,926 Mike, did Shannon kill Stephanie? 645 00:40:50,970 --> 00:40:52,537 No.Why not? 646 00:40:52,580 --> 00:40:53,929 She is much too sweet for that. 647 00:40:53,973 --> 00:40:54,713 What about your mom? 648 00:40:55,931 --> 00:40:57,455 How are you so sure? 649 00:40:57,498 --> 00:40:59,108 Because I just don't wanna think that. 650 00:40:59,152 --> 00:41:00,849 Well, you're gonna have to help us out here, Michael, 651 00:41:00,893 --> 00:41:03,112 because we have a responsibility to Stephanie. 652 00:41:03,156 --> 00:41:04,940 We have to think 653 00:41:04,984 --> 00:41:06,420 who in that house was capable of doing this. 654 00:41:08,117 --> 00:41:09,249 What about your dad? 655 00:41:09,292 --> 00:41:10,598 No, he couldn't have. 656 00:41:10,642 --> 00:41:13,166 We can prove that nobody came in that house. 657 00:41:13,209 --> 00:41:14,472 All the doors were locked, 658 00:41:14,515 --> 00:41:16,212 the windows showed no signs of being entered. 659 00:41:16,256 --> 00:41:18,780 We know the person who did it was inside that house. 660 00:41:18,824 --> 00:41:20,303 Now, it's either Shannon, 661 00:41:20,347 --> 00:41:21,783 or it's your mom, 662 00:41:21,827 --> 00:41:25,657 or it's your dad, or it's you. 663 00:41:25,700 --> 00:41:27,920 I don't want it to be anyone else in my family. 664 00:41:29,225 --> 00:41:31,837 I don't want it to be me. 665 00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:33,969 But you say the evidence points toward me. 666 00:41:36,276 --> 00:41:37,625 I can't remember. 667 00:41:40,062 --> 00:41:42,891 You're asking me questions, I can't remember. 668 00:41:44,632 --> 00:41:46,329 Mike, look at me. 669 00:41:48,070 --> 00:41:50,464 It's not that you don't remember. 670 00:41:50,508 --> 00:41:51,944 It's that you selectively remember. 671 00:41:53,423 --> 00:41:54,512 This has been going on now 672 00:41:54,555 --> 00:41:55,556 for a couple of days, Mike. 673 00:41:57,645 --> 00:41:59,604 You're sharp enough to have planned that out very well. 674 00:42:01,519 --> 00:42:04,043 And you know what, son? 675 00:42:04,086 --> 00:42:06,132 I'm reaching the point to where I'm not buying it anymore. 676 00:42:08,047 --> 00:42:10,223 Think very seriously 677 00:42:10,266 --> 00:42:12,442 because there's two paths. 678 00:42:12,486 --> 00:42:14,096 The path of punishment, which is jail, 679 00:42:15,228 --> 00:42:17,056 and the path that says, 680 00:42:17,099 --> 00:42:19,841 "Hey, I'm sorry for what I did." 681 00:42:25,325 --> 00:42:28,110 I've seen genuine tears, and you know what, son? 682 00:42:28,154 --> 00:42:29,982 I don't see them, okay? 683 00:42:30,025 --> 00:42:31,810 I see the eyes of a child 684 00:42:31,853 --> 00:42:33,507 who's willing to sit here in front of two adults and say, 685 00:42:33,551 --> 00:42:34,813 "Hey, 686 00:42:34,856 --> 00:42:36,684 "I can pull this selected memory 687 00:42:36,728 --> 00:42:37,729 "and get away with it." 688 00:42:39,513 --> 00:42:41,776 If you say I'm guilty, I must be. 689 00:42:44,126 --> 00:42:46,302 I wanna go down that one path, but I can't. 690 00:42:46,346 --> 00:42:47,869 Cut it out, Mike. 691 00:42:47,913 --> 00:42:49,654 Quite frankly, this is not a video game. 692 00:42:49,697 --> 00:42:51,133 This is reality-based, okay? 693 00:42:51,177 --> 00:42:52,831 This interactive game is reality-based, 694 00:42:52,874 --> 00:42:54,093 and there's only two paths. 695 00:42:54,136 --> 00:42:56,138 Only two. 696 00:42:56,182 --> 00:42:57,705 Maybe it would help if you just started talking. 697 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:02,101 Mike? 698 00:43:02,144 --> 00:43:05,800 The reason I'm beginning to sound impatient, Mike, 699 00:43:05,844 --> 00:43:09,848 is because the eleventh hour is rapidly approaching. 700 00:43:09,891 --> 00:43:11,806 We put a rush on some things that, quite frankly, 701 00:43:11,850 --> 00:43:13,373 are gonna bury you, my friend 702 00:43:13,416 --> 00:43:14,809 and you need to head that off at the pass. 703 00:43:15,810 --> 00:43:16,855 Let's hear it, Mike. 704 00:43:20,467 --> 00:43:21,642 I wish I could. 705 00:43:23,557 --> 00:43:24,514 I can't. 706 00:43:28,693 --> 00:43:30,912 What's the worst thing that could happen to me? 707 00:43:30,956 --> 00:43:32,653 The worst thing is not saying what happened, 708 00:43:32,697 --> 00:43:34,612 and you live with this the rest of your life. 709 00:43:34,655 --> 00:43:35,787 That's the worst conceivable thing. 710 00:43:36,788 --> 00:43:38,093 What would they do with me? 711 00:43:39,878 --> 00:43:41,314 The one path, you could spend 712 00:43:41,357 --> 00:43:43,621 a considerable amount of time in jail. 713 00:43:43,664 --> 00:43:47,494 The other path, we can see what we can do to help you live with this. 714 00:43:47,537 --> 00:43:50,584 Right now, Mike, you're sitting here all by yourself. 715 00:43:50,628 --> 00:43:52,760 Whatever happens, what got you here is loneliness. 716 00:43:52,804 --> 00:43:54,893 Let us come into your room, and let us help you out. 717 00:43:54,936 --> 00:43:57,025 Michael, that's not the kind of life you want. 718 00:43:57,069 --> 00:43:59,375 That's not the kind of life you saw your sister leading. 719 00:43:59,419 --> 00:44:00,638 Have you ever seen a prison yard? 720 00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:04,380 No.I've been there, okay? 721 00:44:04,424 --> 00:44:06,774 You shower, you take a crap, you take a leak 722 00:44:06,818 --> 00:44:09,298 in the presence of hundreds of other people who you don't know from Adam, okay? 723 00:44:09,342 --> 00:44:11,605 You do some things that... 724 00:44:11,649 --> 00:44:13,215 Some of your most private and intimate things 725 00:44:13,259 --> 00:44:14,564 are gonna be done in front of prison guards. 726 00:44:14,608 --> 00:44:16,392 You have no privacy, okay? 727 00:44:16,436 --> 00:44:17,698 We don't want that to happen. 728 00:44:17,742 --> 00:44:20,527 What we want is, we want you over here, 729 00:44:20,570 --> 00:44:22,790 where you can get some help. 730 00:44:22,834 --> 00:44:25,184 Time's up. These people are rushing me here. 731 00:44:25,227 --> 00:44:26,533 I wanna go back now. 732 00:44:28,404 --> 00:44:29,536 Are we out of here, Mike? 733 00:44:31,103 --> 00:44:32,234 I guess. 734 00:44:34,846 --> 00:44:38,719 Eventually, someday, I will be able to tell you. 735 00:44:38,763 --> 00:44:40,155 You ought to do it now, man. 736 00:44:40,199 --> 00:44:42,070 Mike. 737 00:44:42,114 --> 00:44:43,724 Tomorrow's not going to work.No, it won't work. 738 00:44:43,768 --> 00:44:45,508 Because the reality is, if it didn't come up tonight, 739 00:44:45,552 --> 00:44:46,596 it ain't never gonna come up. 740 00:44:48,163 --> 00:44:50,600 What I tell you tonight won't be true. 741 00:44:51,689 --> 00:44:53,516 We're at the crossroads. 742 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,214 What do you have to tell me? 743 00:44:55,257 --> 00:44:56,563 Tell us the story, Michael. 744 00:44:59,784 --> 00:45:01,046 Okay. 745 00:45:01,089 --> 00:45:02,482 But I'm telling you right now, 746 00:45:02,525 --> 00:45:03,570 I'll have to make it up. 747 00:45:04,832 --> 00:45:05,964 Tell us the story. 748 00:45:07,661 --> 00:45:09,663 Okay. 749 00:45:11,491 --> 00:45:13,536 This is true. 750 00:45:13,580 --> 00:45:16,017 I am extremely jealous of my sister. 751 00:45:16,061 --> 00:45:16,844 Okay. 752 00:45:18,454 --> 00:45:19,978 She's always had lots of friends. 753 00:45:21,806 --> 00:45:23,503 Good friends. People my age. 754 00:45:25,940 --> 00:45:27,550 I mean, all the popular girls and stuff like that. 755 00:45:27,594 --> 00:45:29,509 That's true, okay? 756 00:45:29,552 --> 00:45:30,771 Let me know when you get to the lie part. 757 00:45:33,513 --> 00:45:35,123 Okay. 758 00:45:35,167 --> 00:45:36,559 Here's where I'll start lying. 759 00:45:38,387 --> 00:45:40,520 That night, I got pissed off. 760 00:45:40,563 --> 00:45:42,740 I couldn't take it anymore. 761 00:45:42,783 --> 00:45:44,350 So I got a knife, 762 00:45:45,177 --> 00:45:46,961 went in, and 763 00:45:47,005 --> 00:45:47,962 I stabbed her. 764 00:45:49,485 --> 00:45:50,878 And I pulled her off the bed. 765 00:45:52,401 --> 00:45:53,533 How many times did you stab her? 766 00:45:57,450 --> 00:45:58,886 This is gonna be a lie. 767 00:46:01,323 --> 00:46:02,760 Three times. 768 00:46:02,803 --> 00:46:05,371 God! I hate telling you that. God! 769 00:46:05,414 --> 00:46:07,416 Well, then tell me what the truth is. 770 00:46:07,460 --> 00:46:10,028 The only reason I'm trying to lie... 771 00:46:10,071 --> 00:46:11,638 You presented me with two paths! 772 00:46:11,681 --> 00:46:13,161 How about beginning at the beginning. 773 00:46:13,205 --> 00:46:14,989 Where did you get the knife?I... I don't know. 774 00:46:15,033 --> 00:46:17,209 What did you do with the knife afterwards?Do you want me to lie? 775 00:46:17,252 --> 00:46:19,777 I want details. Details. Not your hollow lying. 776 00:47:11,219 --> 00:47:12,438 Hello. 777 00:47:13,482 --> 00:47:14,483 Yes. 778 00:47:15,658 --> 00:47:16,921 Yes, this is he. 779 00:47:19,010 --> 00:47:20,098 What is it? 780 00:47:20,141 --> 00:47:21,490 Yes.What's he saying? 781 00:47:24,450 --> 00:47:25,668 You have? 782 00:47:29,716 --> 00:47:30,760 A confession? 783 00:47:32,284 --> 00:47:34,764 Well, who? 784 00:47:34,808 --> 00:47:35,765 Who is it? Who did it? 785 00:47:45,297 --> 00:47:46,689 Stephen... 786 00:47:48,082 --> 00:47:49,431 What? 787 00:47:49,475 --> 00:47:50,911 Tell me. 788 00:47:50,955 --> 00:47:51,694 Tell me. 789 00:48:04,055 --> 00:48:05,708 Police say Michael killed Stephanie. 790 00:48:08,624 --> 00:48:10,626 What are you talking about? 791 00:48:12,498 --> 00:48:13,847 He confessed. 792 00:48:23,465 --> 00:48:24,205 No. 793 00:48:24,727 --> 00:48:25,728 No. 794 00:48:27,600 --> 00:48:29,080 No. 795 00:49:04,376 --> 00:49:05,638 Michael, I wanna hear you say it. 796 00:49:09,555 --> 00:49:10,773 I want you to say it with your own mouth. 797 00:49:16,214 --> 00:49:18,259 Did you have anything to do with this? 798 00:49:18,303 --> 00:49:19,478 Did you murder Stephanie? 799 00:49:21,784 --> 00:49:23,395 I don't know. 800 00:49:23,438 --> 00:49:25,136 Guess you know I did. 801 00:49:25,179 --> 00:49:26,789 Michael. 802 00:49:26,833 --> 00:49:29,140 They told me I did. 803 00:49:29,183 --> 00:49:31,577 What do you mean, they told you? 804 00:49:31,620 --> 00:49:33,535 They kept telling me. 805 00:49:33,579 --> 00:49:35,233 What? What do you mean? 806 00:49:35,276 --> 00:49:38,018 They kept telling me that I killed Stephanie. 807 00:49:38,062 --> 00:49:39,019 For two days. 808 00:49:41,282 --> 00:49:43,023 I don't think I did. 809 00:49:43,067 --> 00:49:44,851 But they said I just don't remember. 810 00:49:46,635 --> 00:49:48,246 I don't know what to believe anymore. 811 00:49:48,289 --> 00:49:50,030 Two days? What? 812 00:49:50,074 --> 00:49:51,858 Nobody even told us that they were questioning you. 813 00:49:53,947 --> 00:49:55,949 They said you knew. 814 00:49:55,993 --> 00:49:58,473 They said that you'd seen the evidence, and you knew I did it. 815 00:49:58,517 --> 00:50:00,998 Michael, that's not true. 816 00:50:01,041 --> 00:50:02,869 They said you weren't coming back for me. 817 00:50:02,912 --> 00:50:05,263 They said that... 818 00:50:05,306 --> 00:50:07,352 You never wanted to see me again. 819 00:50:07,395 --> 00:50:09,136 Michael, listen. 820 00:50:09,180 --> 00:50:11,486 I don't know what they've told you, 821 00:50:11,530 --> 00:50:13,271 but we haven't seen anything. 822 00:50:13,314 --> 00:50:15,447 Okay? Nobody has told us anything. 823 00:50:15,490 --> 00:50:18,972 We would never ever say that we didn't 824 00:50:19,016 --> 00:50:21,844 wanna see you, that we weren't gonna coma back for you. 825 00:50:21,888 --> 00:50:23,933 All we've been doing is waiting for you. 826 00:50:23,977 --> 00:50:26,066 Waiting to get your sister...GUARD: Please... 827 00:50:26,110 --> 00:50:27,459 Cheryl. Cheryl. Cheryl.You and your sister back, 828 00:50:27,502 --> 00:50:28,851 like they told us we have to.STEPHEN: It's okay. 829 00:50:30,114 --> 00:50:31,767 Dad, I'm sorry. 830 00:50:32,725 --> 00:50:33,726 I'm so sorry. 831 00:50:35,771 --> 00:50:38,470 They said that I can't remember. 832 00:50:38,513 --> 00:50:41,516 That I'm doing this on purpose. That I don't wanna remember. 833 00:50:43,170 --> 00:50:45,607 I was there in that room all those hours, 834 00:50:45,651 --> 00:50:48,393 everything made sense, but now it doesn't. 835 00:50:48,436 --> 00:50:50,395 Michael, why would you tell anyone? 836 00:50:50,438 --> 00:50:52,266 You don't know what it was like! 837 00:50:52,310 --> 00:50:54,268 They said that they found blood in my room, 838 00:50:54,312 --> 00:50:56,966 that, that, that I could have blacked out. 839 00:50:57,010 --> 00:50:58,664 But wouldn't I remember? 840 00:51:00,883 --> 00:51:03,234 No! No, don't leave. Don't leave me here, please! 841 00:51:04,452 --> 00:51:06,585 Honey, we can't. 842 00:51:06,628 --> 00:51:08,282 Honey...Please don't keep me here, Mom. 843 00:51:08,326 --> 00:51:11,198 You have to stay here, just, just for now. 844 00:51:11,242 --> 00:51:13,331 Time to go.Michael... Please, just please, one minute. 845 00:51:13,374 --> 00:51:15,072 The district attorney told us 846 00:51:15,115 --> 00:51:15,724 that there's going to be a court appearance, okay? 847 00:51:15,768 --> 00:51:17,378 In a couple of days. 848 00:51:17,422 --> 00:51:20,164 Okay? And they're gonna appoint an attorney for you. 849 00:51:20,207 --> 00:51:22,427 All right? So, listen, it may take a little while, 850 00:51:22,470 --> 00:51:24,385 but we're gonna get you outta here, okay? 851 00:51:24,429 --> 00:51:26,953 So, you gotta trust us on that, Michael. 852 00:51:26,996 --> 00:51:29,173 Okay? So, you have to believe that. 853 00:51:41,750 --> 00:51:43,796 All the time we thought they were being taken care of. 854 00:51:48,670 --> 00:51:50,063 He didn't do it. 855 00:51:50,107 --> 00:51:52,152 Why would the police say...Stephen. 856 00:51:52,196 --> 00:51:53,371 They obviously have something to go on. 857 00:51:53,414 --> 00:51:55,329 Stephen, how can you for one minute... 858 00:51:55,373 --> 00:51:56,939 Cheryl, they said that they found evidence. 859 00:51:56,983 --> 00:51:58,027 Blood in his room. 860 00:51:58,071 --> 00:52:00,073 Stephen, you saw him in there! 861 00:52:00,117 --> 00:52:02,380 I know. I know I did. 862 00:52:02,423 --> 00:52:04,164 But why would they, you know... 863 00:52:04,208 --> 00:52:06,035 And I know that he didn't do it. He would never... 864 00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:08,690 I don't know what they did to make him say that. 865 00:52:08,734 --> 00:52:10,649 Whether they pressured him till he had a breakdown or... 866 00:52:10,692 --> 00:52:11,737 I know, I know. 867 00:52:11,780 --> 00:52:13,042 But he didn't do it. 868 00:52:24,271 --> 00:52:29,581 Will Michael be coming home with us to Uncle David and Aunt Jill's? 869 00:52:29,624 --> 00:52:32,018 Listen, honey, Michael's in a juvenile hall. 870 00:52:33,802 --> 00:52:37,023 And he's gonna have to stay there for a while. 871 00:52:37,066 --> 00:52:38,067 How long? 872 00:52:43,247 --> 00:52:45,336 We're not sure. 873 00:52:45,379 --> 00:52:47,207 Come here. Don't worry. 874 00:52:47,251 --> 00:52:48,991 No, don't worry. 875 00:52:49,035 --> 00:52:51,342 We're gonna get him out. 876 00:52:51,385 --> 00:52:53,170 We're gonna get him out as soon as we can. 877 00:52:55,041 --> 00:52:56,738 Experience has taught me, 878 00:52:56,782 --> 00:52:59,001 assume the worst about a client, 879 00:52:59,045 --> 00:53:01,221 because... Good morning, thank you. 880 00:53:01,265 --> 00:53:03,484 There's a 90% chance that he's guilty. 881 00:53:03,528 --> 00:53:05,530 But in this case... 882 00:53:05,573 --> 00:53:08,141 I watched these tapes last night, 883 00:53:08,185 --> 00:53:11,144 all eleven-plus hours of them, 884 00:53:11,188 --> 00:53:13,494 and got this horrible feeling. 885 00:53:13,538 --> 00:53:16,149 Michael's innocent, and he's looking at a life sentence. 886 00:53:19,152 --> 00:53:21,459 Make yourselves comfortable. Can I get you anything? 887 00:53:21,502 --> 00:53:22,721 Coffee? Water?No. no. Thank you. We're fine. 888 00:53:22,764 --> 00:53:25,245 No, thanks. 889 00:53:25,289 --> 00:53:28,248 Wouldn't there have been blood on his shoes or his clothes? 890 00:53:28,292 --> 00:53:29,945 Or fingernails. I know, it's absurd. 891 00:53:29,989 --> 00:53:32,165 The facts don't support any of it. 892 00:53:32,209 --> 00:53:34,254 But a confession is a powerful thing. 893 00:53:34,298 --> 00:53:37,083 It's just about the most powerful evidence the prosecution can have. 894 00:53:37,126 --> 00:53:38,737 Jury almost always accepts it. 895 00:53:38,780 --> 00:53:42,044 Miss Sorenson, why did they zero in on our son? 896 00:53:42,088 --> 00:53:44,438 They were suspicious for two reasons. 897 00:53:44,482 --> 00:53:46,484 He seemed, to them, 898 00:53:46,527 --> 00:53:49,008 oddly unaffected by his sister's stabbing. 899 00:53:49,051 --> 00:53:50,966 They don't know him.And he told a story 900 00:53:51,010 --> 00:53:52,272 about walking by her room 901 00:53:52,316 --> 00:53:53,578 two hours before she was found 902 00:53:53,621 --> 00:53:55,362 without noticing anything. 903 00:53:55,406 --> 00:53:57,625 They thought that he should have seen her body in the doorway. 904 00:53:57,669 --> 00:53:59,845 We weren't even told that they were talking to our kids. 905 00:53:59,888 --> 00:54:01,150 We would have been there. 906 00:54:01,194 --> 00:54:03,022 I mean, can they do that without our permission? 907 00:54:03,065 --> 00:54:05,154 Oh, yes. By law, they certainly can. 908 00:54:05,198 --> 00:54:06,852 They are allowed to interrogate a juvenile 909 00:54:06,895 --> 00:54:08,723 without a parent present, 910 00:54:08,767 --> 00:54:10,856 as long as the child is aware of his Miranda rights 911 00:54:10,899 --> 00:54:12,684 and agrees to waive them. 912 00:54:12,727 --> 00:54:14,512 Why would anybody waive their rights? 913 00:54:14,555 --> 00:54:17,906 Oh, many people do. Over 80% of criminal suspects. 914 00:54:17,950 --> 00:54:19,995 And it is always against their best interests. 915 00:54:20,039 --> 00:54:21,432 He's a child. 916 00:54:21,475 --> 00:54:23,825 How is he supposed to know his best interests? 917 00:54:23,869 --> 00:54:26,306 It really doesn't make a difference whether he's a child or an adult. 918 00:54:26,350 --> 00:54:28,221 Most people don't know their rights when they're arrested, 919 00:54:28,265 --> 00:54:30,745 what they can or cannot do. 920 00:54:30,789 --> 00:54:33,270 A lot of the times, I think that the police, 921 00:54:33,313 --> 00:54:36,185 they make the suspect feel as if it's a friendly situation 922 00:54:36,229 --> 00:54:38,927 and calling a lawyer will only make things more difficult. 923 00:54:38,971 --> 00:54:41,974 In fact, if you are being interrogated 924 00:54:42,017 --> 00:54:44,803 as a suspect in a crime 925 00:54:44,846 --> 00:54:48,067 and you have not yet been charged, 926 00:54:48,110 --> 00:54:49,416 you have the right 927 00:54:49,460 --> 00:54:50,548 to walk out of the police station. 928 00:54:51,940 --> 00:54:53,551 I didn't know that. 929 00:54:53,594 --> 00:54:56,075 This is from the first session. 930 00:54:57,468 --> 00:54:59,121 Which was the day after the murder. 931 00:55:01,646 --> 00:55:04,301 You need to let it go. 932 00:55:04,344 --> 00:55:08,305 This is gonna get very intolerable, and it's going to eat you like a cancer. 933 00:55:08,348 --> 00:55:10,872 Listen to me for a second. 934 00:55:10,916 --> 00:55:13,962 Maybe there's something we need to understand about Michael 935 00:55:14,006 --> 00:55:16,400 and about your sister that we didn't understand. 936 00:55:16,443 --> 00:55:18,097 Are you getting sick? 937 00:55:18,140 --> 00:55:19,664 I... I didn't do it. 938 00:55:19,707 --> 00:55:21,753 You need to help me here, Mike. 939 00:55:21,796 --> 00:55:23,624 I know. 940 00:55:23,668 --> 00:55:25,496 I would, but I didn't do this! 941 00:55:27,019 --> 00:55:28,412 They found blood in your room already. 942 00:55:30,544 --> 00:55:31,328 God! 943 00:55:33,504 --> 00:55:35,070 There's two paths. 944 00:55:35,114 --> 00:55:36,811 The path of punishment, which is jail, 945 00:55:36,855 --> 00:55:38,465 or the path that says, 946 00:55:38,509 --> 00:55:40,859 "Hey, I'm sorry for what I did." 947 00:55:40,902 --> 00:55:42,861 I see the eyes of a child who's willing to sit here 948 00:55:42,904 --> 00:55:44,602 in front of two adults and say, 949 00:55:44,645 --> 00:55:46,560 "I can pull this selective memory and get away with it." 950 00:55:57,832 --> 00:56:00,400 How often do you think you got punished for something that maybe 951 00:56:00,444 --> 00:56:02,533 Stephanie should have got punished for? 952 00:56:02,576 --> 00:56:03,925 What do you think? 953 00:56:03,969 --> 00:56:04,970 Maybe daily. 954 00:56:05,753 --> 00:56:07,886 She'd scream, "Mom." 955 00:56:07,929 --> 00:56:10,062 Bingo, I'm in trouble. Sent to my room. 956 00:56:12,107 --> 00:56:13,370 That's why I hid in there. 957 00:56:16,416 --> 00:56:18,287 I tried coming out. Doesn't work. 958 00:56:18,331 --> 00:56:20,551 They don't want me around. 959 00:56:20,594 --> 00:56:22,335 I tried explaining that to them, 960 00:56:22,379 --> 00:56:23,858 and they looked at me like I was psycho! 961 00:56:25,556 --> 00:56:27,035 How? 962 00:56:27,079 --> 00:56:29,081 They're geniuses and gods and goddesses, 963 00:56:29,124 --> 00:56:30,343 but me, I'm just slime. 964 00:56:30,387 --> 00:56:32,301 I don't deserve to be in the room. 965 00:56:38,917 --> 00:56:40,701 I think they made the assumption he was guilty 966 00:56:40,745 --> 00:56:42,486 before they even started talking to him. 967 00:56:42,529 --> 00:56:45,097 Oh, they had a theory, and they stuck to it. 968 00:56:45,140 --> 00:56:48,448 Once they decide to do an interrogation, there is one goal. 969 00:56:48,492 --> 00:56:51,233 It is not to get the truth, it is to get a confession. 970 00:56:51,277 --> 00:56:53,888 They told him that they found blood in his room. 971 00:56:53,932 --> 00:56:55,194 Can they do that? 972 00:56:55,237 --> 00:56:56,891 Lie like that?Absolutely. 973 00:56:56,935 --> 00:56:59,067 It is not illegal for the police to lie about evidence 974 00:56:59,111 --> 00:57:00,068 during an interrogation. 975 00:57:00,112 --> 00:57:01,505 Unbelievable. 976 00:57:01,548 --> 00:57:03,245 They can do just about anything they want. 977 00:57:03,289 --> 00:57:05,378 They also told him that they could prove nobody got into the house, 978 00:57:05,422 --> 00:57:08,337 when, in fact, not all the doors were secured. 979 00:57:08,381 --> 00:57:10,252 They can tell him they found his fingerprints, 980 00:57:10,296 --> 00:57:11,993 that a witness saw him. 981 00:57:12,037 --> 00:57:13,778 That evidence was found, blood, whatever, that points to him. 982 00:57:13,821 --> 00:57:15,257 That he failed a lie detector test. 983 00:57:15,301 --> 00:57:16,824 None of it has to be true. 984 00:57:16,868 --> 00:57:20,088 Right. And what was that voice stress machine thing? 985 00:57:20,132 --> 00:57:22,221 A crock is what it is. 986 00:57:22,264 --> 00:57:24,310 It is seemingly so high tech, 987 00:57:24,353 --> 00:57:27,182 but studies show, that its reliability in determining deception 988 00:57:27,226 --> 00:57:28,488 is less than a coin toss. 989 00:57:28,532 --> 00:57:30,577 It's just a way for them to intimidate. 990 00:57:30,621 --> 00:57:34,233 An interrogation is deliberately designed to be intimidating. 991 00:57:35,713 --> 00:57:37,062 It is plain as day 992 00:57:37,105 --> 00:57:39,891 that this boy was psychologically coerced. 993 00:57:39,934 --> 00:57:42,850 And that'll be the basis of Michael's defense. 994 00:57:42,894 --> 00:57:44,635 Thank God we have it on tape. 995 00:58:37,601 --> 00:58:39,690 Detective Claytor? 996 00:58:39,733 --> 00:58:41,561 I'm Susie Houser. 997 00:58:41,605 --> 00:58:43,302 My son's Aaron Houser. 998 00:58:43,345 --> 00:58:45,565 He's friends with Michael and Josh Treadway. 999 00:58:45,609 --> 00:58:47,567 Yes. 1000 00:58:47,611 --> 00:58:51,310 Sorry, uh, but, I know this may be nothing, 1001 00:58:51,353 --> 00:58:54,443 but when this happened, I insisted that Aaron check his knife collection. 1002 00:58:55,183 --> 00:58:57,011 So he did. 1003 00:58:57,055 --> 00:58:59,144 And he says one's missing. 1004 00:58:59,187 --> 00:59:01,494 It just seemed like something you might wanna know about. 1005 00:59:02,582 --> 00:59:04,889 Yes, Mrs. Houser, it is. 1006 00:59:04,932 --> 00:59:06,107 I'll probably be in touch. 1007 00:59:16,161 --> 00:59:17,423 This your knife, Josh? 1008 00:59:19,947 --> 00:59:22,210 Joshua Treadway, you're under arrest. 1009 00:59:22,254 --> 00:59:24,604 You have the right to remain silent. 1010 00:59:24,648 --> 00:59:27,128 Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. 1011 00:59:37,443 --> 00:59:39,097 No. 1012 00:59:40,402 --> 00:59:41,360 Oh, my God. 1013 01:01:06,488 --> 01:01:08,534 This is all they left of her. 1014 01:01:11,885 --> 01:01:14,496 It's like they're trying to erase every trace of her. 1015 01:01:24,419 --> 01:01:25,594 My baby. 1016 01:01:38,172 --> 01:01:40,740 Can't even stop to grieve for her. 1017 01:01:40,784 --> 01:01:42,829 If we do, we'll lose our son, too. 1018 01:01:42,873 --> 01:01:44,135 I know. 1019 01:01:45,310 --> 01:01:46,311 I know. 1020 01:01:59,063 --> 01:02:00,499 If I can do anything... 1021 01:02:00,542 --> 01:02:02,544 Thanks, Bill. 1022 01:02:02,588 --> 01:02:04,546 That homeless guy, I thought that was gonna turn into something. 1023 01:02:07,811 --> 01:02:09,638 Oh, he was pounding on everybody's door that night, 1024 01:02:09,682 --> 01:02:12,380 saying he was looking for some ex-girlfriend. 1025 01:02:12,424 --> 01:02:15,644 I wasn't the only one who reported him. 1026 01:02:15,688 --> 01:02:18,169 Are the police sure that he had nothing to do with it? 1027 01:02:19,823 --> 01:02:20,737 What homeless guy? 1028 01:02:23,652 --> 01:02:25,263 Detective. 1029 01:02:25,306 --> 01:02:26,786 Detective, this man... 1030 01:02:26,830 --> 01:02:28,353 This transient...Mrs. Crowe, 1031 01:02:28,396 --> 01:02:30,485 we brought him in and we questioned him a couple of times. 1032 01:02:30,529 --> 01:02:32,183 He didn't murder your daughter. 1033 01:02:32,226 --> 01:02:34,751 You're, you're certain of that? 1034 01:02:34,794 --> 01:02:37,666 He's too mentally incapable to have carried out a random murder 1035 01:02:37,710 --> 01:02:39,799 in a house filled with people. 1036 01:02:39,843 --> 01:02:42,541 Look, your son's responsible. 1037 01:02:42,584 --> 01:02:44,848 How can you say that? 1038 01:02:44,891 --> 01:02:48,808 Detective, just tell us how you came to that conclusion. 1039 01:02:48,852 --> 01:02:51,593 Sibling rivalry that just got out of hand. 1040 01:02:51,637 --> 01:02:54,596 Sibling rivalry? It just doesn't make sense. 1041 01:02:54,640 --> 01:02:56,424 Look, we know Michael. 1042 01:02:56,468 --> 01:02:57,817 Okay? And, whatever. 1043 01:02:57,861 --> 01:02:59,993 Every kid says that kind of stuff about his sister. 1044 01:03:00,037 --> 01:03:01,429 You show me a 14-year-old kid 1045 01:03:01,473 --> 01:03:03,910 who isn't moody and belligerent at times. 1046 01:03:03,954 --> 01:03:07,958 Detective, my son has never been in trouble a day in his life. 1047 01:03:08,001 --> 01:03:10,438 He's never even been to the principal's office. 1048 01:03:10,482 --> 01:03:12,745 We've made two more arrests. 1049 01:03:12,789 --> 01:03:14,399 Joshua Treadway and Aaron Houser. 1050 01:03:22,973 --> 01:03:24,844 What did Josh and Aaron tell them? 1051 01:03:24,888 --> 01:03:27,629 What the police wanted to hear. 1052 01:03:27,673 --> 01:03:29,240 I saw the tapes. 1053 01:03:29,283 --> 01:03:31,590 The police told each of them 1054 01:03:31,633 --> 01:03:33,853 that the other two had ratted on them. 1055 01:03:33,897 --> 01:03:35,333 They kept telling Josh Treadway 1056 01:03:35,376 --> 01:03:37,509 that he was the lookout until he told them that he was. 1057 01:03:37,552 --> 01:03:38,858 But how could they do that? 1058 01:03:38,902 --> 01:03:40,033 They kept him in there all night. 1059 01:03:40,077 --> 01:03:42,296 He couldn't even go to the bathroom. 1060 01:03:42,340 --> 01:03:45,038 Josh said that he got up and he walked over to Aaron's house. 1061 01:03:45,082 --> 01:03:46,692 That's over 10 miles away. 1062 01:03:46,735 --> 01:03:48,999 Josh gets lost five blocks from home. 1063 01:03:49,042 --> 01:03:51,740 Then Josh said that he and Aaron walked to your place, 1064 01:03:51,784 --> 01:03:53,786 and Aaron and Michael went in and killed Stephanie 1065 01:03:53,830 --> 01:03:54,831 while Josh was the lookout. 1066 01:03:57,224 --> 01:03:59,270 Did Aaron confess, too? 1067 01:03:59,313 --> 01:04:02,055 No. He said that he was at home, studying for finals. 1068 01:04:02,099 --> 01:04:05,058 They asked him how he would kill someone if he wanted to, 1069 01:04:05,102 --> 01:04:07,756 hypothetically, and he told them, 1070 01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:09,715 rather convincingly I'd say. 1071 01:04:09,758 --> 01:04:11,673 And now they have all three boys in juvenile hall. 1072 01:04:13,240 --> 01:04:14,546 Would you excuse me just for a moment? 1073 01:04:21,205 --> 01:04:22,728 Hello, Mr. Parker... 1074 01:04:22,771 --> 01:04:23,860 They didn't do this. 1075 01:04:28,212 --> 01:04:29,604 What are we supposed to do now? 1076 01:04:32,259 --> 01:04:35,001 For starters, we can't afford to believe a thing the police tell us. 1077 01:04:36,089 --> 01:04:36,873 Not anymore. 1078 01:04:45,751 --> 01:04:48,449 I think you're gonna... Really gonna like the new place. 1079 01:04:48,493 --> 01:04:50,190 It's actually a lot closer to town now. 1080 01:04:50,234 --> 01:04:52,540 We're two blocks from the video store. 1081 01:04:53,193 --> 01:04:54,412 So... 1082 01:04:54,455 --> 01:04:57,241 Much closer to school. 1083 01:04:57,284 --> 01:04:58,503 Maybe that's not so hot. 1084 01:04:59,808 --> 01:05:01,462 Your room's great. 1085 01:05:01,506 --> 01:05:02,942 Your stuff looks great in it. 1086 01:05:02,986 --> 01:05:03,725 Yeah. 1087 01:05:06,032 --> 01:05:08,208 Here, we got you something. 1088 01:05:09,906 --> 01:05:11,777 Shannon thought you'd like that. 1089 01:05:11,820 --> 01:05:12,909 She bought it with her own money. 1090 01:05:14,998 --> 01:05:16,608 Tell her I said thanks. 1091 01:05:18,436 --> 01:05:19,437 She... 1092 01:05:21,004 --> 01:05:23,267 Is she gonna do anything this summer? 1093 01:05:23,310 --> 01:05:25,269 Uh... 1094 01:05:25,312 --> 01:05:28,533 Maybe volunteer at the library. 1095 01:05:28,576 --> 01:05:29,708 She's looking into that. 1096 01:05:31,928 --> 01:05:33,494 Tell her I think that's cool. 1097 01:05:33,538 --> 01:05:34,539 Okay. 1098 01:05:39,979 --> 01:05:42,503 Listen, uh, there's gonna be something 1099 01:05:42,547 --> 01:05:43,983 called a 707 hearing 1100 01:05:44,027 --> 01:05:45,854 coming up in a couple of weeks. 1101 01:05:45,898 --> 01:05:48,379 Where they decide whether they'll try us as juveniles or adults. 1102 01:05:48,422 --> 01:05:49,554 Ms. Sorenson told me. 1103 01:05:50,250 --> 01:05:52,687 Right. 1104 01:05:52,731 --> 01:05:55,777 Well, she, she says that these hearings are, you know, just... 1105 01:05:55,821 --> 01:05:57,518 Pretty in and out, you know. No big deal. 1106 01:05:57,562 --> 01:06:00,434 They try me as an adult, then they can ask for life. 1107 01:06:00,478 --> 01:06:02,045 Michael...Somebody in here told me that. 1108 01:06:02,088 --> 01:06:05,874 Michael, Ms. Sorenson knows that your confession was coerced. 1109 01:06:05,918 --> 01:06:07,572 Okay? Yours and Josh's. 1110 01:06:07,615 --> 01:06:09,530 She's trying to get them thrown out. 1111 01:06:09,574 --> 01:06:11,576 If they show those confessions, 1112 01:06:11,619 --> 01:06:14,579 everybody'll hear those awful things I said about Stephanie and you guys. 1113 01:06:14,622 --> 01:06:16,494 Honey, we know what happened. 1114 01:06:16,537 --> 01:06:18,539 You keep saying that! 1115 01:06:18,583 --> 01:06:21,847 But you can't ever know how they break you down, what it's like! 1116 01:06:21,890 --> 01:06:23,892 Sweetheart... 1117 01:06:26,547 --> 01:06:29,289 Okay, that's it.We'll be back on Sunday. 1118 01:06:29,333 --> 01:06:31,988 Then Thursday again, and the next Sunday. 1119 01:06:34,251 --> 01:06:35,687 I wish they'd let Shannon come. 1120 01:06:37,210 --> 01:06:38,516 You'll see each other soon. 1121 01:06:40,431 --> 01:06:43,608 Mom, I can't stand this. 1122 01:06:45,566 --> 01:06:48,395 Sometimes I feel like I can't breathe. 1123 01:06:48,439 --> 01:06:50,876 My heart starts racing like mad, 1124 01:06:50,919 --> 01:06:52,269 like it's gonna burst out of me. 1125 01:06:52,921 --> 01:06:54,532 Michael... 1126 01:06:54,575 --> 01:06:55,663 Let's go.Michael, then you know what? 1127 01:06:55,707 --> 01:06:56,795 You call us. Okay? 1128 01:06:56,838 --> 01:06:58,405 Listen, 1129 01:06:58,449 --> 01:06:59,972 you call us when you're feeling that way. 1130 01:07:00,016 --> 01:07:01,669 I can't. I can't do that. 1131 01:07:01,713 --> 01:07:03,671 They listen in. They'll just twist what I say. 1132 01:07:03,715 --> 01:07:05,325 Michael... 1133 01:07:05,369 --> 01:07:06,805 Michael, we know you didn't do this, 1134 01:07:06,848 --> 01:07:08,850 and we're doing everything we can to get you out of here. 1135 01:07:11,418 --> 01:07:12,941 Listen, you gotta believe that, okay? 1136 01:07:12,985 --> 01:07:14,900 Just you be strong. Okay? 1137 01:07:17,120 --> 01:07:19,383 We love you. Don't forget that. 1138 01:07:35,529 --> 01:07:37,096 Hello, Cheryl, nice to meet you. 1139 01:07:40,012 --> 01:07:44,451 All right, um, the upshot is that they lack forensic evidence. 1140 01:07:44,495 --> 01:07:46,975 So they're going to be relying very heavily on the confessions 1141 01:07:47,019 --> 01:07:48,194 to make their case. 1142 01:07:48,238 --> 01:07:49,543 Right, which is what worries us. 1143 01:07:49,587 --> 01:07:51,980 Well, thank God the confessions were taped. 1144 01:07:52,024 --> 01:07:54,157 They show all the tricks the police used. 1145 01:07:54,200 --> 01:07:56,594 I've consulted with Richard Ofshe, a professor at Berkeley. 1146 01:07:56,637 --> 01:07:58,683 He is an expert on coercion. 1147 01:07:58,726 --> 01:08:02,208 He's investigated dozens of false confessions in murder cases. 1148 01:08:02,252 --> 01:08:05,472 You wouldn't believe how many times this happens in this country. 1149 01:08:05,516 --> 01:08:07,300 He has reviewed the tapes 1150 01:08:07,344 --> 01:08:10,173 and concludes that these are classic examples 1151 01:08:10,216 --> 01:08:12,610 of coerced confessions. 1152 01:08:12,653 --> 01:08:16,179 Michael caved in to threats and all sorts of promises, 1153 01:08:16,222 --> 01:08:19,399 and Joshua was fed details of the crime and used them to make up a story. 1154 01:08:19,443 --> 01:08:21,619 Ofshe will say as much in court. 1155 01:08:21,662 --> 01:08:23,447 Will that prove them innocent? 1156 01:08:23,490 --> 01:08:26,102 Well, there'll be no deciding innocence or guilt here. 1157 01:08:26,145 --> 01:08:29,540 This'll be a hearing about whether to try them as adults or juveniles. 1158 01:08:29,583 --> 01:08:31,237 The judge will look at all the evidence, 1159 01:08:31,281 --> 01:08:32,978 including their confessions. 1160 01:08:33,021 --> 01:08:35,198 If the judge decides to try them as adults, 1161 01:08:35,241 --> 01:08:36,677 there is good news and bad news. 1162 01:08:36,721 --> 01:08:37,896 We know the bad news. 1163 01:08:37,939 --> 01:08:40,028 Well, if they're tried as adults, 1164 01:08:40,072 --> 01:08:42,118 we'll finally be able to post bond and bring them home. 1165 01:08:42,161 --> 01:08:45,599 The prosecutors do not have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt 1166 01:08:45,643 --> 01:08:48,298 that the three committed the crime in order for them to be tried. 1167 01:08:48,341 --> 01:08:50,256 The issue that is before the judge 1168 01:08:50,300 --> 01:08:52,867 is whether there is a strong suspicion 1169 01:08:52,911 --> 01:08:54,782 the three killed Stephanie. 1170 01:08:54,826 --> 01:08:57,785 So, we're going to prepare for the 707 1171 01:08:57,829 --> 01:09:00,832 as if it an all-out trial rather than a hearing. 1172 01:09:00,875 --> 01:09:03,356 I am getting them to agree to let us preview all the evidence. 1173 01:09:12,670 --> 01:09:14,193 What are you doing in there? 1174 01:09:14,237 --> 01:09:15,803 Storing the evidence or cooking it? 1175 01:09:43,614 --> 01:09:45,050 Can I see the other side, please? 1176 01:09:47,922 --> 01:09:50,186 Richard Tuite's clothes. 1177 01:09:51,883 --> 01:09:53,841 Yeah, the transient. 1178 01:09:53,885 --> 01:09:55,930 Hmm. 1179 01:09:55,974 --> 01:09:58,803 This could be blood set in a spatter pattern. 1180 01:09:58,846 --> 01:10:00,761 I want this tested for DNA. 1181 01:10:00,805 --> 01:10:02,285 It was tested. I told you before. 1182 01:10:02,328 --> 01:10:04,156 And no sign of blood was found. 1183 01:10:04,200 --> 01:10:05,984 I don't care. I'm entitled to have it tested again. 1184 01:10:08,378 --> 01:10:10,031 I've been tracking this Richard Tuite. 1185 01:10:10,075 --> 01:10:12,033 Yeah, me, too. 1186 01:10:12,077 --> 01:10:14,297 This has gotta be our guy. He's got a string of convictions, 1187 01:10:14,340 --> 01:10:17,213 and a 1993 arrest for stabbing a guy with a steak knife 1188 01:10:17,256 --> 01:10:19,867 in a transient camp.I know. 1189 01:10:19,911 --> 01:10:22,043 And another arrest shortly after Stephanie's murder 1190 01:10:22,087 --> 01:10:24,220 for ogling two 12-year-old girls on a bus, 1191 01:10:24,263 --> 01:10:26,396 and then following them home. 1192 01:10:26,439 --> 01:10:27,962 They brought him in on that, Dorothy. They questioned him. 1193 01:10:28,006 --> 01:10:29,442 Well, he's just been arrested again for attempted burglary. 1194 01:10:29,486 --> 01:10:31,531 He's in jail pending trial. 1195 01:10:31,575 --> 01:10:33,838 Police have never taken him seriously as a suspect in this case. 1196 01:10:33,881 --> 01:10:35,361 I know. 1197 01:10:35,405 --> 01:10:36,493 I talked to Claytor about it. 1198 01:10:36,536 --> 01:10:38,886 He says because of the mental illness, 1199 01:10:38,930 --> 01:10:40,148 Tuite's incapable of being a killer, 1200 01:10:40,192 --> 01:10:41,237 even if he wanted to. 1201 01:10:41,280 --> 01:10:43,282 Bull! He's just saving face. 1202 01:10:43,326 --> 01:10:45,632 Hey, the guy survived on the street all this time, 1203 01:10:45,676 --> 01:10:47,330 kept himself fed and clothed, 1204 01:10:47,373 --> 01:10:49,070 he obviously has his lucid moments. 1205 01:11:27,108 --> 01:11:28,196 All rise. 1206 01:11:38,511 --> 01:11:41,471 I have looked at almost 40 hours of tapes, 1207 01:11:41,514 --> 01:11:44,038 read all the transcripts. 1208 01:11:44,082 --> 01:11:46,127 It's important to recognize at the outset, 1209 01:11:46,171 --> 01:11:48,347 we're here because a 12-year-old girl 1210 01:11:48,391 --> 01:11:51,437 was brutally murdered in her bedroom at night, 1211 01:11:51,481 --> 01:11:55,267 and three young boys have been charged with that murder. 1212 01:11:55,311 --> 01:11:57,095 We all know what's in our hearts. 1213 01:11:57,138 --> 01:11:58,749 All the confusion, 1214 01:11:58,792 --> 01:12:01,317 the emotions, the incredible issues 1215 01:12:01,360 --> 01:12:05,408 that impact these kids, their families, and the community. 1216 01:12:05,451 --> 01:12:08,498 But what will rule are the careful, 1217 01:12:08,541 --> 01:12:10,238 legal thoughts. 1218 01:12:10,282 --> 01:12:12,458 The careful arguments. 1219 01:12:12,502 --> 01:12:17,028 The carefully thought out issues and facts and law 1220 01:12:17,071 --> 01:12:21,293 that will ultimately determine the issues that I have to decide. 1221 01:12:21,337 --> 01:12:24,644 The Serological Research Institute Lab has issued its report. 1222 01:12:24,688 --> 01:12:26,777 It's all in our favor.STEPHEN: What does it say? 1223 01:12:26,820 --> 01:12:30,128 There was no DNA or blood found on Aaron's knife. 1224 01:12:30,171 --> 01:12:33,610 The hair in Stephanie's hand could not be positively identified. 1225 01:12:33,653 --> 01:12:36,830 The only prints in the house are yours, your family's. 1226 01:12:36,874 --> 01:12:39,050 And there were no prints found either on the knife, but Josh's. 1227 01:12:39,093 --> 01:12:41,139 Not Michael's or Aaron's? 1228 01:12:41,182 --> 01:12:42,836 But the police are going to contend that it was the murder weapon, 1229 01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:44,403 even if they can't prove it. 1230 01:12:44,447 --> 01:12:47,188 Why?Because they really believe the boys did it. 1231 01:12:47,232 --> 01:12:49,582 They just don't have any hard evidence to back it up. 1232 01:12:49,626 --> 01:12:52,455 All they really have are the damn confessions. 1233 01:12:52,498 --> 01:12:53,543 Yeah. Ed Mathers here. 1234 01:12:53,586 --> 01:12:55,414 Ed, hey. What's the deal? 1235 01:12:55,458 --> 01:12:58,199 Nothing yet.I need the DNA results. 1236 01:12:58,243 --> 01:13:00,811 Richard Tuite's clothes are still at the lab, Dorothy. 1237 01:13:00,854 --> 01:13:03,030 When I know, you'll know. 1238 01:13:03,074 --> 01:13:06,556 Now, these are not three everyday, ordinary teenagers 1239 01:13:06,599 --> 01:13:11,691 who happen to enjoy interactive video games with fantasy themes. 1240 01:13:11,735 --> 01:13:14,346 There are much darker forces at play here. 1241 01:13:14,390 --> 01:13:17,697 All along, they were plotting evil. 1242 01:13:17,741 --> 01:13:20,831 Look at the evidence in Michael Crowe's bedroom. 1243 01:13:20,874 --> 01:13:23,399 The games, the books. 1244 01:13:23,442 --> 01:13:28,012 The medieval-themed items, like Dungeons & Dragons. 1245 01:13:28,055 --> 01:13:31,319 No, the darker reality is that these three boys 1246 01:13:31,363 --> 01:13:34,801 became so wrapped up in the fantasy of these games 1247 01:13:34,845 --> 01:13:36,455 that they crossed the line 1248 01:13:36,499 --> 01:13:39,850 and became perpetrators of cold-blooded murder. 1249 01:13:49,816 --> 01:13:52,515 I'm gonna cut to the chase. 1250 01:13:52,558 --> 01:13:57,607 I find that the People have established a prima facie case. 1251 01:13:57,650 --> 01:14:01,959 But these confessions-slash- admissions are troublesome. 1252 01:14:03,526 --> 01:14:06,006 I've read and re-read the transcripts, 1253 01:14:06,050 --> 01:14:10,010 looked at the videotapes until I'm blue in the face. 1254 01:14:10,054 --> 01:14:12,796 I believe that when Michael broke down, 1255 01:14:12,839 --> 01:14:15,886 he gave the scenario that had been handed to him. 1256 01:14:15,929 --> 01:14:18,410 And the same techniques were used on Joshua. 1257 01:14:20,673 --> 01:14:23,197 There are problems in here. 1258 01:14:23,241 --> 01:14:25,635 There are things that will have to be answered, 1259 01:14:25,678 --> 01:14:27,724 and that's something a jury will have to decide. 1260 01:14:29,377 --> 01:14:31,292 That said, 1261 01:14:31,336 --> 01:14:33,251 they will be tried as adults. 1262 01:14:35,471 --> 01:14:37,647 I will release all three minors on their own recognizance 1263 01:14:37,690 --> 01:14:40,693 pending trial in a superior court. 1264 01:14:40,737 --> 01:14:43,174 Ms. Sorenson, how do you think this decision will affect your case? 1265 01:14:43,217 --> 01:14:44,784 Is this the judgment that you expected? 1266 01:14:46,656 --> 01:14:49,049 What it means is that a neutral party 1267 01:14:49,093 --> 01:14:51,138 has finally raised some pretty serious questions 1268 01:14:51,182 --> 01:14:54,011 about the nature of these alleged confessions. 1269 01:14:54,054 --> 01:14:56,274 Do you think the District Attorney's Office will drop the case? 1270 01:14:58,363 --> 01:15:01,148 Well, I wouldn't want to speculate on that. 1271 01:15:01,192 --> 01:15:03,716 Come on, Michael, wait till you see how big my room is. 1272 01:15:03,760 --> 01:15:05,326 Shannon, slow down, all right? 1273 01:15:05,370 --> 01:15:06,458 Take it easy on him. 1274 01:15:06,502 --> 01:15:08,242 I wanna show him, I wanna show him 1275 01:15:08,286 --> 01:15:10,201 how I fixed it up.STEPHEN: You've got lots of time. 1276 01:15:20,124 --> 01:15:22,082 What about lunch, guys? How about some pizza? 1277 01:15:24,520 --> 01:15:25,521 Yeah. 1278 01:15:26,130 --> 01:15:27,566 Pizza would be great. 1279 01:15:27,610 --> 01:15:29,786 Come on, Michael, I want you to see my room. 1280 01:15:29,829 --> 01:15:32,266 Uh, honey, maybe he wants to see his own room, huh? 1281 01:15:32,310 --> 01:15:33,267 Did you ever think of that? 1282 01:15:35,182 --> 01:15:35,966 Okay. 1283 01:15:36,009 --> 01:15:37,010 Come on. 1284 01:16:02,383 --> 01:16:03,384 Mike. 1285 01:16:07,519 --> 01:16:09,695 How was the first day of school? 1286 01:16:09,739 --> 01:16:11,915 Nobody asked how I spent my summer vacation. 1287 01:16:14,526 --> 01:16:18,095 Well, I was gonna run down and maybe get a movie. 1288 01:16:18,138 --> 01:16:20,184 Wanna come with me? Maybe we'll get something up. 1289 01:16:23,840 --> 01:16:26,407 You know, I don't know any of these movies, so 1290 01:16:26,451 --> 01:16:28,845 I need your help. 1291 01:16:28,888 --> 01:16:30,629 I've been stared at enough for one day, thank you. 1292 01:16:32,370 --> 01:16:33,676 You have to ignore it. 1293 01:16:35,503 --> 01:16:37,593 You have to just be yourself. 1294 01:16:37,636 --> 01:16:39,464 And in time, it will be okay. 1295 01:16:39,507 --> 01:16:42,641 How? It'll never be okay again. 1296 01:16:42,685 --> 01:16:44,991 You have no idea what my life is like. 1297 01:16:45,035 --> 01:16:47,603 You're right.Everybody thinks I killed my sister! 1298 01:16:49,387 --> 01:16:50,693 I wish I'd been killed, too. 1299 01:16:52,172 --> 01:16:54,479 Oh, God, Mike, no. 1300 01:16:55,523 --> 01:16:57,134 No. 1301 01:16:57,177 --> 01:16:59,789 No. You're right. I... 1302 01:16:59,832 --> 01:17:01,442 I can't know what you're going through. 1303 01:17:01,486 --> 01:17:03,053 Nobody can. 1304 01:17:03,096 --> 01:17:04,750 And it isn't fair. 1305 01:17:04,794 --> 01:17:07,579 And there is nothing I can say or do. 1306 01:17:07,623 --> 01:17:10,364 But you have to find a way to just get on. 1307 01:17:13,498 --> 01:17:15,500 When I lost Stephanie, and I had to stand by 1308 01:17:15,543 --> 01:17:17,458 while they did all those awful things to you, 1309 01:17:17,502 --> 01:17:20,244 I had to find a way to get on, and I didn't think I could do it. 1310 01:17:20,287 --> 01:17:22,507 I didn't think I had it in me. 1311 01:17:22,550 --> 01:17:24,770 And most days, I'm still not that sure. 1312 01:17:25,902 --> 01:17:27,425 But you just do. 1313 01:17:29,079 --> 01:17:30,080 You just do. 1314 01:17:38,741 --> 01:17:39,872 And I'm here. 1315 01:17:57,020 --> 01:17:59,109 Today began the second week of pre-trial hearings... 1316 01:17:59,152 --> 01:18:00,501 Thanks.Anytime. 1317 01:18:00,545 --> 01:18:02,590 ...in the Stephanie Crowe murder case. 1318 01:18:02,634 --> 01:18:06,769 Judge Thompson will determine whether statements obtained by the police 1319 01:18:06,812 --> 01:18:09,075 will be excluded from their trial, 1320 01:18:09,119 --> 01:18:11,730 which is expected to begin early next month. 1321 01:18:11,774 --> 01:18:13,253 Public defenders in this case 1322 01:18:13,297 --> 01:18:16,169 are hopeful that the statements will not be allowed. 1323 01:18:16,213 --> 01:18:17,736 The District Attorney was on. 1324 01:18:17,780 --> 01:18:20,826 She kept on calling her "the little dead girl." 1325 01:18:20,870 --> 01:18:24,787 They say that without them, there is little hard evidence to convict the three boys. 1326 01:18:47,244 --> 01:18:48,506 So tired of this. 1327 01:18:51,552 --> 01:18:53,511 If this is how this system works, then... 1328 01:18:56,079 --> 01:18:58,603 If something happens now, some emergency? 1329 01:18:58,646 --> 01:18:59,604 What are we supposed to do? 1330 01:19:01,040 --> 01:19:02,215 Call these cops? 1331 01:19:04,304 --> 01:19:05,610 Can't call these cops. 1332 01:19:23,193 --> 01:19:26,326 She was a very important person. She had a name. 1333 01:19:26,370 --> 01:19:29,590 Nobody even remembers that. 1334 01:19:29,634 --> 01:19:32,463 All of us do, people who knew her and loved her. 1335 01:19:36,162 --> 01:19:38,904 So bright a light, shall never truly fade away. 1336 01:19:42,255 --> 01:19:45,215 I'm afraid I'm gonna forget her, stuff about her. 1337 01:19:45,258 --> 01:19:47,826 Her voice, what she sounds like. 1338 01:19:47,870 --> 01:19:48,653 You won't. 1339 01:19:52,222 --> 01:19:55,138 "So bright a light..." 1340 01:19:55,181 --> 01:19:56,313 Did you write that, Michael? 1341 01:20:15,027 --> 01:20:17,073 Bye-bye. 1342 01:20:17,116 --> 01:20:20,990 Well, this is it. Whatever happens here. 1343 01:20:21,033 --> 01:20:24,036 If Judge Thompson decides the confessions can be used in trial... 1344 01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:26,473 Well, let's just hope he doesn't. 1345 01:20:26,517 --> 01:20:28,084 How are you feeling, Michael? 1346 01:20:28,127 --> 01:20:29,563 Uh, I feel good. 1347 01:20:29,607 --> 01:20:31,261 Good. You just keep thinking that way. 1348 01:20:34,917 --> 01:20:37,310 Whether intentional or unintentional, 1349 01:20:37,354 --> 01:20:40,226 police engaged in a coercive scheme 1350 01:20:40,270 --> 01:20:43,186 that led to promises of leniency for Michael Crowe 1351 01:20:43,229 --> 01:20:46,493 if he admitted involvement in the homicide. 1352 01:20:46,537 --> 01:20:50,149 As a result, the statement by him cannot be used at trial. 1353 01:20:52,978 --> 01:20:56,808 Though Aaron Houser provided a hypothetical description of killing someone, 1354 01:20:56,852 --> 01:20:59,898 detectives did not advise him of his Miranda rights. 1355 01:20:59,942 --> 01:21:02,205 I'm barring Aaron's statement as well. 1356 01:21:04,555 --> 01:21:06,905 Joshua Treadway's statement, 1357 01:21:06,949 --> 01:21:09,473 I'm excluding all but the last two hours. 1358 01:21:09,516 --> 01:21:12,215 Because while it was voluntary, not coerced, 1359 01:21:12,258 --> 01:21:16,175 there were no Miranda rights until the final two hours. 1360 01:21:16,219 --> 01:21:19,396 At that point, Joshua repeated how the killing was planned and executed. 1361 01:21:20,701 --> 01:21:22,399 I will allow that part. 1362 01:21:22,442 --> 01:21:25,141 But it can only be used against Joshua Treadway 1363 01:21:25,184 --> 01:21:26,751 and not the other two boys. 1364 01:21:26,794 --> 01:21:28,144 Josh Treadway is gonna be tried first? 1365 01:21:28,187 --> 01:21:29,406 That's right.Did the judge indicate 1366 01:21:29,449 --> 01:21:30,929 when Michael and Aaron will be tried? 1367 01:21:30,973 --> 01:21:33,149 At some later date. Though now they cannot use 1368 01:21:33,192 --> 01:21:35,934 his alleged confession at the trial. 1369 01:21:35,978 --> 01:21:37,893 The detectives testified that their primary motivation 1370 01:21:37,936 --> 01:21:39,285 was to get at the truth. 1371 01:21:39,329 --> 01:21:41,809 What these police officers wanted to get at 1372 01:21:41,853 --> 01:21:44,551 was their version of the truth, not the truth itself. 1373 01:21:44,595 --> 01:21:46,727 Michael's confession, so-called, 1374 01:21:46,771 --> 01:21:48,338 has been seen for what it is. 1375 01:21:48,381 --> 01:21:49,905 Now this trial will have to be about the facts. 1376 01:21:59,001 --> 01:22:01,612 Hey.Hey. 1377 01:22:01,655 --> 01:22:05,616 Well, not one of these potential jurors believes that somebody 1378 01:22:05,659 --> 01:22:07,183 could confess to something they didn't do. 1379 01:22:09,402 --> 01:22:10,621 Dorothy Sorenson. 1380 01:22:10,664 --> 01:22:11,839 It's Ed Mathers. 1381 01:22:11,883 --> 01:22:14,451 We need to get you and the prosecutor 1382 01:22:14,494 --> 01:22:17,497 and the other attorneys on the line at the same time. 1383 01:22:17,541 --> 01:22:18,977 You have the DNA results, don't you? 1384 01:22:21,980 --> 01:22:25,679 The DNA results on Richard Tuite's red sweatshirt... 1385 01:22:25,723 --> 01:22:27,377 The results are definitive. 1386 01:22:27,420 --> 01:22:28,856 What do you mean, definitive? 1387 01:22:28,900 --> 01:22:30,858 On three areas of the sweatshirt. 1388 01:22:31,555 --> 01:22:33,078 Are you sure? 1389 01:22:33,122 --> 01:22:35,951 Yes. It means that you can rule out 1390 01:22:35,994 --> 01:22:37,822 anybody who ever walked the planet Earth 1391 01:22:37,865 --> 01:22:39,389 as a donor of that bloodstain 1392 01:22:39,432 --> 01:22:41,652 on Richard Tuite's sweatshirt, except 1393 01:22:42,783 --> 01:22:43,959 Stephanie Crowe. 1394 01:22:44,002 --> 01:22:45,569 Oh, God, thank you! 1395 01:22:45,612 --> 01:22:47,005 Oh! 1396 01:22:47,049 --> 01:22:47,788 Oh! 1397 01:22:48,615 --> 01:22:49,660 Thank you. 1398 01:23:10,768 --> 01:23:12,857 I can't believe this nightmare is over. 1399 01:23:12,900 --> 01:23:14,467 You know what, it's not. 1400 01:23:15,425 --> 01:23:16,861 Why not? 1401 01:23:16,904 --> 01:23:19,429 Judge Thompson is gonna allow them time to explain 1402 01:23:19,472 --> 01:23:22,040 why Stephanie's blood was found on Richard Tuite's sweatshirt. 1403 01:23:22,084 --> 01:23:24,608 What? Why? What is to explain? 1404 01:23:24,651 --> 01:23:27,437 Oh, there is all sorts of speculation out there. 1405 01:23:27,480 --> 01:23:30,744 Did Tuite somehow come in contact with the boys? 1406 01:23:30,788 --> 01:23:33,530 Did he maybe find bloody clothes the boys had thrown away? 1407 01:23:33,573 --> 01:23:35,706 Oh, come on. 1408 01:23:35,749 --> 01:23:37,969 Was the shirt somehow contaminated by equipment at the crime scene? 1409 01:23:38,013 --> 01:23:39,231 Or by me? 1410 01:23:39,275 --> 01:23:41,451 By you? How could you have done it? 1411 01:23:41,494 --> 01:23:44,062 They're suggesting that I put the blood there somehow. 1412 01:23:44,106 --> 01:23:45,194 Ridiculous. 1413 01:23:45,237 --> 01:23:47,544 Ed Mathers, the DNA guy, 1414 01:23:47,587 --> 01:23:51,461 says the drops on the shirt are spatter-type stains, 1415 01:23:51,504 --> 01:23:53,854 indicating they were projected forcefully onto the shirt, 1416 01:23:53,898 --> 01:23:56,074 not through accidental contact. 1417 01:23:56,118 --> 01:23:59,469 But, despite that, they're not going to throw in the towel on this yet. 1418 01:23:59,512 --> 01:24:00,252 You can count on it. 1419 01:24:17,313 --> 01:24:22,274 Richard, can you tell me why you're in here right now? 1420 01:24:22,318 --> 01:24:24,885 I'm in here right now because they think I burglarized something. 1421 01:24:25,886 --> 01:24:28,498 I did not burglarize anything. 1422 01:24:28,541 --> 01:24:31,414 We don't wanna talk about that, okay? 1423 01:24:31,457 --> 01:24:32,850 Do you remember the little girl that was killed 1424 01:24:32,893 --> 01:24:34,373 up in Escondido? 1425 01:24:35,157 --> 01:24:37,681 No. 1426 01:24:37,724 --> 01:24:41,250 We're here to find out if you had something to do with that. 1427 01:24:41,293 --> 01:24:43,426 A lot of people are trying to say that maybe you did. 1428 01:24:43,469 --> 01:24:45,080 And now they're bringing up a lot of questions, 1429 01:24:45,123 --> 01:24:48,605 and we're just trying to maybe get some answers. 1430 01:24:50,259 --> 01:24:52,348 Richard, you're not in any kind of trouble. 1431 01:24:52,391 --> 01:24:53,175 We're here to help you. 1432 01:24:55,742 --> 01:24:57,048 You're here to help me? 1433 01:24:59,746 --> 01:25:02,314 How can you help me? 1434 01:25:02,358 --> 01:25:04,186 Richard, there are some people that think you killed that little girl. 1435 01:25:04,229 --> 01:25:05,012 Did you? 1436 01:25:07,928 --> 01:25:09,321 You know what? We believe you, we do. 1437 01:25:09,365 --> 01:25:10,627 We're not the ones who say you did it, 1438 01:25:10,670 --> 01:25:12,759 but there are some people who say you did. 1439 01:25:12,803 --> 01:25:14,065 All we wanna know is what you can tell us 1440 01:25:14,109 --> 01:25:15,588 about when you were up there 1441 01:25:15,632 --> 01:25:17,112 and when Detective Baker took your clothes. 1442 01:25:19,505 --> 01:25:22,160 Well, obviously, I'm not responsible for killing anybody. 1443 01:25:22,204 --> 01:25:24,597 Do you remember giving a shirt to somebody, 1444 01:25:24,641 --> 01:25:27,122 or giving somebody a shirt that had blood on it? 1445 01:25:29,298 --> 01:25:30,603 No. 1446 01:25:30,647 --> 01:25:32,170 Do you remember giving your clothes 1447 01:25:32,214 --> 01:25:33,954 to anybody else besides Detective Baker 1448 01:25:33,998 --> 01:25:35,608 up in Escondido? 1449 01:25:35,652 --> 01:25:37,132 Did you give your shirt to somebody? 1450 01:25:57,848 --> 01:25:59,458 This is the thing we have been hoping for, isn't it? 1451 01:25:59,502 --> 01:26:03,114 No. They are dismissing the case without prejudice. 1452 01:26:03,158 --> 01:26:06,248 When you hear the word "dismissal," that's not what it means. 1453 01:26:06,291 --> 01:26:08,293 Uh, you lost me.What it means is, 1454 01:26:08,337 --> 01:26:10,339 they still think the boys are guilty. 1455 01:26:10,382 --> 01:26:11,862 Why? Why? What do you mean? 1456 01:26:11,905 --> 01:26:14,821 They've put together a 40-page motion to dismiss 1457 01:26:14,865 --> 01:26:16,693 that lays out their case against the boys, 1458 01:26:16,736 --> 01:26:18,129 saying they think they're guilty, 1459 01:26:18,173 --> 01:26:19,870 they just can't prove it right now. 1460 01:26:19,913 --> 01:26:22,873 Or ever.And they need more time to investigate. 1461 01:26:22,916 --> 01:26:24,614 Right. So where does that leave us? 1462 01:26:24,657 --> 01:26:27,573 It leaves us nowhere. 1463 01:26:27,617 --> 01:26:30,315 It leaves us knowing that the prosecution 1464 01:26:30,359 --> 01:26:32,622 could come back any time they want 1465 01:26:32,665 --> 01:26:33,884 and charge Michael again. 1466 01:26:33,927 --> 01:26:35,364 Come on. That is ridiculous. 1467 01:26:35,407 --> 01:26:36,930 Yes, basically they're saying, 1468 01:26:36,974 --> 01:26:39,585 despite the DNA evidence on Richard Tuite's shirt, 1469 01:26:39,629 --> 01:26:41,065 they still think all the boys are guilty. 1470 01:26:41,108 --> 01:26:42,197 Wait a minute. 1471 01:26:42,240 --> 01:26:44,024 Don't they care about the truth? 1472 01:26:44,068 --> 01:26:46,157 No, if they cared about the truth, they'd go after Richard Tuite. 1473 01:26:46,201 --> 01:26:47,854 This is about something else. 1474 01:26:47,898 --> 01:26:49,769 This is about their not wanting this to be another 1475 01:26:49,813 --> 01:26:51,510 JonBenet Ramsey investigation. 1476 01:26:51,554 --> 01:26:55,384 They made a hasty and unwise judgment 1477 01:26:55,427 --> 01:26:56,994 and, by God, they're sticking with it. 1478 01:27:00,650 --> 01:27:02,086 We can't let them get away with this. 1479 01:27:04,915 --> 01:27:08,614 Stephen and Cheryl Crowe have filed a civil suit 1480 01:27:08,658 --> 01:27:10,181 against the city of Escondido, 1481 01:27:10,225 --> 01:27:12,227 the Escondido Police Department, 1482 01:27:12,270 --> 01:27:14,664 and the San Diego county prosecutors. 1483 01:27:14,707 --> 01:27:17,362 Stephen, Cheryl, why file suit now? 1484 01:27:17,406 --> 01:27:19,408 Didn't the judge dismiss the case? 1485 01:27:19,451 --> 01:27:21,192 Without prejudice, 1486 01:27:21,236 --> 01:27:24,282 meaning they can re-file against the boys at any time. 1487 01:27:24,326 --> 01:27:26,806 Why do you think the prosecution chose that route? 1488 01:27:26,850 --> 01:27:29,853 Because they don't want to admit the obvious. 1489 01:27:29,896 --> 01:27:31,855 They were prosecuting innocent people, 1490 01:27:31,898 --> 01:27:33,335 and they let a murderer walk free. 1491 01:27:34,901 --> 01:27:38,514 And this is still hanging over our son's head. 1492 01:27:38,557 --> 01:27:40,080 You know, I mean, how are we supposed to explain to him 1493 01:27:40,124 --> 01:27:41,995 that he gave up a year of his life? 1494 01:27:42,039 --> 01:27:44,433 I mean, a year, 1495 01:27:44,476 --> 01:27:47,436 so that the police department in this town could save face, you know. 1496 01:27:47,479 --> 01:27:48,872 It's not right. 1497 01:27:48,915 --> 01:27:52,179 Thank God these interrogations were taped. 1498 01:27:52,223 --> 01:27:55,357 If Michael and the other boys had just written out their confessions 1499 01:27:55,400 --> 01:27:58,925 and signed them, can you imagine where we would be? 1500 01:27:58,969 --> 01:28:01,711 The judge might very well not have thrown them out. 1501 01:28:01,754 --> 01:28:05,932 Every interrogation and confession in this country, 1502 01:28:05,976 --> 01:28:07,891 ought to be videotaped. 1503 01:28:07,934 --> 01:28:09,501 That is all there is to it. 1504 01:28:09,545 --> 01:28:12,374 In this day and age, there is no reason not to. 1505 01:28:12,417 --> 01:28:14,941 They're saving face 1506 01:28:14,985 --> 01:28:16,813 at Stephanie's expense, 1507 01:28:16,856 --> 01:28:18,162 and Michael's, 1508 01:28:19,163 --> 01:28:20,556 and our family's. 1509 01:28:22,645 --> 01:28:25,865 We don't intend to let them do that. 1510 01:28:25,909 --> 01:28:29,391 Whatever we have to do to see that the truth comes out, 1511 01:28:29,434 --> 01:28:30,609 that there is justice. 1512 01:28:33,569 --> 01:28:35,310 We have to see that the truth comes out.